Silver2009

I have finally hit the wall with my 04 GTO and I am now unsure if I will ever risk buying a first year GM ever again. What Pontiac didn't do to itself in styling with the GTO, Holden did for them in quality control. Consider that I have experienced the following with my GTO with just over 27K miles:

OLD ISSUES
1. Bad BFG tires (wouldn't balance, not covered under waranty)
2. Driver door lock actuator
3. Passenger door lock actuator
4. Loose windshield molding
5. Whacky guages, reprogrammed but still acting up
6. Blown BCM: no gas door, no power windows, etc
7. Driver seat switch button inopt
8. Faulty driver and passenger seat tracks
9. MPH numbers too bright in cluster
10. Bad oxygen sensor

NEW ISSUES
1. Popping in back seat, probably subpar welds
2. Fan relay is bad, fans stay on after turning car off (just happened today, and the reports on the forums say that the relays are really hard to get!)

I loved my 00 SS, and my 98 C5. They were bullet proof and reliable. I baby the GTO, and it just keeps breaking. The GTO forum is full of multiple reports of these issues with the 04s, and even more issues with the 05/06. I'm really worried about another GM vehicle coming from HOLDEN. Maybe it's the left hand conversion work that causes the pain, but our new CAMARO has to be better than this!

Saddest part of this story is the fact that many folks are living with these bugs because they love the car and/or they are loyal to GM. I pray that they test the Hell out of the car so that it isn't doomed to the quality bug!

Flame suit on.........

JB22

The camaro isnt going to be manufactured by holden like the GTO was.

JasonD

But could there still be the same 1st year bugs and issues regardless? Or has that issue been eliminated by new manufacturing and testing technology?

georgejetson

Hopefully Holden's experience with building Zeta-based cars will help inform Camaro production, getting some of the bugs out in advance. (OTOH, they're getting that experience with the car that's about to become the G8, which needs to be good.)

The thing about the GTO is that it wasn't really a first-year car, was it? When did Holden start building that version of the Monaro?

97z28/m6

2003.

Silver2009

I hate to be the guinee pig. G8 or Camaro. I had planned to buy a G8 too! It's the engineering that is at fault with the GTO IMO. I can't believe that HOLDEN is used to the string of issues that GTO are living with. If keeping the car until 09 gets it right, then keep it. If it leaves the pad with bugs, it will be doomed a bigger failure than the GTO due to it's exposure.

Now it's off to Barrett Jackson.

TA76

Wow... another good reason for not trading my 02 WS6 on a GTO! My 02 has never been in the shop. However, I did purchase a first year Colorado and it has been in the shop once (ECU problem, had to be reflashed) but it has well over 50K on it now.

ChrisL

Every manufacturer has "problem" cars, and unfortunately, it looks like you ended up with one.

I have to report the exact opposite experience. We have an 04 GTO, M6. We picked it up in Dec, '04. It has about 32k on it now.

The car is still tight. There are no sqeaks or rattles. The doors still close effortlessly, again, no squeaks or rattles.

The only problem I've ever had so far was the wacky gauges when pulling it into the garage once.

The build quality of the car is lightyears ahead of 4th gens.

Sure, there were some sacrifices made from an engineering perspective when the car was redesigned for US import. All in all, for whats gotta be an 8-9 year old platform, I've been impressed with it.

As far as 1st year build issues.... every company has things they alter after cars are introduced. Simply put, once a car goes into production, there's tons more data feeding back to the engineers. There's feedback coming from customers warranty claims, assembly line, supplier, etc, etc, etc.

That being said, 1st year build issues are becoming less and less of an issue with today's engineering advances. Especially for major things.

If you look at GMs recent product launches, there haven't been any major "train wrecks".

I wouldn't worry about it. If you want one the first year, then go for it.

Silver2009

I love these cars, and I'm not taking pot shots at GM, but I do feel that everyone needs to be aware of what many GTO owners are going through. My wifes Nissans never went to the shop, and I hear that from her alot.

Doug Harden

Keep in mind too, that people who 'don't' have problems don't post in internet forums...so the problems seem worse that they are as a whole.

I'm sorry you have had those problems though and I would be as disillusioned as you had it happened to me.

ChrisL

No offenese taken. I would not be a happy owner if I had your issues, and yes, I'm aware of the issues many folks have had, including two friend's 04 GTOs that were bought back by GM.

I was just posting my experiences so far, which have been positive.

All this being said, the Monaro was an old platform to start. Then it was bastardized errrr...uummm.... reengineered to meet US crash standards.

None of this will be the case for Camaro since the designers and engineers started with a clean sheet.

georgejetson

This is true of the G8 as well -- supposedly it was designed from the start with US production in mind, and of course it's on the global Zeta platform.

2000GTP

There is probably a chance that there will be some first year bugs. Nothing wrong with waiting until the following year.. unless you want to own the first year's lineup, but that is the risk you take with any first year production car.