Decromin

It does make me wonder sometimes, that people keep commenting on the cars suitability for drag and road race competitions. Does anyone seriously beleive that GM (or any other large manufacturer) would look at drag strips and circuit racing as primary design requirements for a mainstream model?

Sure - they tune suspension on the Nurburgring, and perform standing start tests, but no one is going to be in an initial design meeting saying:

"I know IRS is far better for 95% of our customers, but a handful want to drag race their car, so we must develop a suspension system that will be great for that 5%, and compromised for the other 95%."

Perhaps they would use a shorter sentance tho ...

landstuhltaylor

most of the v6 owners will not drag race their cars, but i believe a significant percentage of the v8 owners will, even if its just once. gm has to be aware of that.

97z28/m6

how about when all the mags go test it and say that it was a stupid ameriain piece of.... due to all the wheel hop. i'm sure that will help GM sell them. it should be able to withstand anything that the engine can dish out with no problems.

JCS30TH

Is there really that much of a ride/handling diff with IRS that justifies the cost/weight over a solid axle? I have never driving a car with one, so i have no clue

97z28/m6

go drive a G35 over a rough road then drive your F-body over the same patch.

JCS30TH

considering my f-body rides like a train

BigDarknFast

Call me jaded. But the mags are going to whine about domestic cars no matter what. They're stuck in a mis-informed '1980s pack mentality' which thinks import makes are the best no matter what. Their bias has even got to the point that (IIRC) GM pulled ad budgets in some cases such as a major news paper out in Cali earlier this year.

But as for 'being able to handle anything the engine can dish out'? Nope. Especially when some track racers do 5k RPM clutch dumps, mount up drag radials, and so forth, then go to their dealer with rubber flung all over their wheelhouses complaining about their busted diff. Too bad for you, if you abuse your car and the dealer voids your warranty - next time don't abuse your car.

Agreed. IRS makes a BIG difference on real-world roads.

STOCK1SC

Ah yes the infamous Toyota Corolla/ Geo Prizm reviews back from the early 90's I believe it highlight's this mentallity the best. Both cars built at the same plant but the Geo a rebadged Toyota sold by GM. One of the test mags drove both cars and said the Toyota was great and then they bitched about everything in the Geo saying it was junk, they just were too wrapped up in the "Domestics Suck" mentallity that they didn't realize what bafoons they made themselves look like.

Capn Pete

Maybe I'm naive, or think too highly of us here on CZ28.com, but YES, GM does have to consider what people ("enthusiasts") will be doing with these cars. Why would they bother with ~400 HP engines, 12", 13", 14" brakes, power steering coolers, tranny coolers/diff coolers (Z06?), and other things related to performance if they thought everybody buying a Camaro was just going to commute to work and back with it??
How many Mustang owners do you think have to go back to their dealer with busted diffs as compared to Camaro/Firebird owners?? Probably 10:1 the number of busted F-body diffs to Mustang diffs, because Ford didn't under-engineer that part of the car. Heck, look at how many guys stuff 8.8" and 9" FORD diffs into their F-bodies!?

GM absolutely must (know) that they've gotta make this car capable, and capable of standing up to itself . Give me IRS in a Camaro, but if they're not going to design a NEW system, then give us the one from the GTO or the 'Vette! If you don't believe they WILL lose sales to the Mustang or Challenger if they don't make this car capable of withstanding some abuse (within reason) then you've got your head in the sand .

greg_nate

My '02 SS with solid axle had wheel hop like mad. On at least two occasions the hop was so severe that it actually hurt my neck to the point that it was sore for a few days.

My '04 Vette has IRS and about 150 more HP than the SS...never once had wheel hop.

Just my experiences and $.02.

greg_nate

Ask Stars1010 or guionM about this, but I recall someone saying specifically that the suspension in the new Camaro was intentionally designed to withstand 500 hp. To me, that says a lot about insight into design considerations and enthusiast input.

Decromin

Everything you have listed does not require major chassis redesigns. The fundamental structure of the suspension is a fairly critical design decision that needs to be made based on the majority of buyers - ie: the people who will make or break the sales figures.

Either way, a true "enthusiast" will simply drop in a new suspension kit if the car needs it.

toneloc12345

I think if GM didn't take into consideration that Camaro owners might take their car to the drag-strip, they should just go ahead and stop making cars because they would be ignorant.

A friend of mine that works for honda R&D was talking about how they RAMP a ridgeline for testing.

Capn Pete

Convertibles need major chassis redesigns too, and the "majority" of buyers don't buy them, so why do they bother then?

Point is, they are putting in what the "majority" will want, which is a nice driving, nice handling IRS suspension. The owners/drivers/passengers should appreciate it, and the car mags will also not frown upon GM for lack of current technology (although they still cut up the Corvette's single leaf spring IRS). BUT, they SHOULD consider what owners do with their cars ... the Corvette diff is a version of a Dana 60 IIRC? It's plenty strong enough for stock 'Vettes and even modded 'Vettes. The old 7.5" 10-bolt in the F-bodies was laughable ... it couldn't even stand up to STOCK power, let alone MODDED .

I'm not asking them to engineer some major chassis design ... they've gone and done that themselves. I'm asking that the parts they use be stronger than weaker, because they have the option of installing either. We could get something tough like the 'Vettes/GTOs, or something not-so-tough like CTS .

Dave89IROC

newer vette rears are on their owm, the c3/c4 ones were based on the Dana 44, same as the viper