Fact or Fiction? PHR says 300 HP V6 Standard
02-06-2008, 12:03 PM
#31
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: TX Med Ctr
Posts: 4,000
02-06-2008, 12:05 PM
#32
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: SoCal
Posts: 3,463
02-06-2008, 12:40 PM
#33
Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 547
However it is still a parasitic loss when the valve is open, because the SC is still spinning and they take power to spin. Granted it is less than when they are compressing, it still does take power to spin it. Add this, plus a AC compressor, etc etc, it all adds up. I know it's not like its going to rob 50 hp, but I would much rather see 2 small turbos which when not in use, have zero parasitic loss to the engine. They have to do all they can these days to try to meet that 35 mpg BS.
02-06-2008, 12:41 PM
#34
BBOMG Organizer
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 520
If the base Camaro retails for $25,000, then this car is dead on arrival.
Sure, a trick, 300-hp V6 is nice. I'd love to see one as an available option. As the base engine? At a 20% premium over a base Mustang? I don't see that being a formula for success. Especially when you consider GM expects to sell 100,000 cars per year.
Sure, a trick, 300-hp V6 is nice. I'd love to see one as an available option. As the base engine? At a 20% premium over a base Mustang? I don't see that being a formula for success. Especially when you consider GM expects to sell 100,000 cars per year.
02-06-2008, 12:53 PM
#35
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Greenville, SC
Posts: 1,897
For anyone interested to see "comparable" mustang prices:
http://www.fordvehicles.com/cars/mustang/
Then click on the "MODELS" tab.
02-06-2008, 01:22 PM
#36
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Jacksonville Florida
Posts: 881
I agree, 25K is too much for a base V-6 Camaro!!! The Mustang still comes in at 19,500 for the "cheapest" V-6 car with the ragtops starting at 24,300.
For anyone interested to see "comparable" mustang prices:
http://www.fordvehicles.com/cars/mustang/
Then click on the "MODELS" tab.
For anyone interested to see "comparable" mustang prices:
http://www.fordvehicles.com/cars/mustang/
Then click on the "MODELS" tab.
02-06-2008, 01:26 PM
#37
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: TX Med Ctr
Posts: 4,000
You're right, I forgot about the bypass valves they have on them now.
However it is still a parasitic loss when the valve is open, because the SC is still spinning and they take power to spin. Granted it is less than when they are compressing, it still does take power to spin it. Add this, plus a AC compressor, etc etc, it all adds up. I know it's not like its going to rob 50 hp, but I would much rather see 2 small turbos which when not in use, have zero parasitic loss to the engine. They have to do all they can these days to try to meet that 35 mpg BS.
However it is still a parasitic loss when the valve is open, because the SC is still spinning and they take power to spin. Granted it is less than when they are compressing, it still does take power to spin it. Add this, plus a AC compressor, etc etc, it all adds up. I know it's not like its going to rob 50 hp, but I would much rather see 2 small turbos which when not in use, have zero parasitic loss to the engine. They have to do all they can these days to try to meet that 35 mpg BS.
02-06-2008, 01:44 PM
#38
Prominent Member
Join Date: Dec 1999
Posts: 2,282
BTW, the story is half wrong....
02-06-2008, 01:47 PM
#39
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Kansas City, MO
Posts: 1,958
It will be more than the Mustang, way more than a dollar more, but not 20% more, either. Scott has already said that it will be within a few hundred dollars for most models.
The 286 horse 3.6 DI that is coming in the Traverse likely doesn't cost any less than the 300 horse one in the CTS, so I don't think using it instead would save money on the bottom line - even though Chevy would likely charge less for it.
And no matter what we do, Camaro will be 100% more expensive than the cheapest current Mustang with an independent rear suspension.
The 286 horse 3.6 DI that is coming in the Traverse likely doesn't cost any less than the 300 horse one in the CTS, so I don't think using it instead would save money on the bottom line - even though Chevy would likely charge less for it.
And no matter what we do, Camaro will be 100% more expensive than the cheapest current Mustang with an independent rear suspension.
02-06-2008, 02:57 PM
#40
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 72
I agree, 25K is too much for a base V-6 Camaro!!! The Mustang still comes in at 19,500 for the "cheapest" V-6 car with the ragtops starting at 24,300.
For anyone interested to see "comparable" mustang prices:
http://www.fordvehicles.com/cars/mustang/
Then click on the "MODELS" tab.
For anyone interested to see "comparable" mustang prices:
http://www.fordvehicles.com/cars/mustang/
Then click on the "MODELS" tab.
Mustang GT is only 300hp. Camaro DI V6, 300hp. Theoretically speaking, 25k is right where the V6 should be placed.
02-06-2008, 02:58 PM
#41
Registered User
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Jacksonville Florida
Posts: 881
02-06-2008, 02:58 PM
#42
Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Greenville, SC
Posts: 1,897
02-06-2008, 03:20 PM
#43
Registered User
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 253
While the Mustang might go up a bit in price over a couple of years.
Don't bet on it being just 300hp by 2010.
Too many unknowns at this point to even bother comparing.
02-06-2008, 03:31 PM
#44
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 9
Yeah, they might steal some sales from GT owners, or prospective GT buyers, but I guarantee you that those numbers won't be anywhere near enough to ensure the Camaro's success. It's going to be hard enough for the Camaro to compete as it is, without the benefit of platform sharing.
02-06-2008, 03:36 PM
#45
BBOMG Organizer
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
Posts: 520
Do we honestly believe that the majority of people looking to buy either a Mustang GT 'vert or a Camaro SS 'vert are going to care that the Camaro has an extra *insert HP here* when it will cost 5 grand more? Most new Mustang GT owners rarely ring out the car anyways and I suspect the same will apply for the majority of Camaro Z/28 or SS car owners.