Maybe he does realize it? Maybe some of us are just a bit brighter than some wish to believe? Perhaps we're just not as easily swayed?

Anyway, I'm hopeful that all my questions (pertaining to Camaro...not those I just posted above) will be answered in September at Indy. I am genuinely looking forward to it.

Bob

 

Hey Elie!

I'm sure you could still submit something in time for the June issue? Or you could show up to a meeting for a change!!!

Now here's a question that I don't think has been asked yet, and this shouldn't compromise any "top-secret" information .....

..... exactly HOW HARD did you push the cars anyways?!?! Enough to REALLY get a feel for how it's gonna handle?? How did it FEEL when driving? Did you do any hard launches? Hard stops? How are the brakes? Was at least 1 of the V8 cars a 6-speed so you could really get a feel for the power??

Again, I'm very envious of everyone who got this opportunity, but I'm sure you represented us well .

See ya out at the track sometime this summer?? (we're at Mosport DDT this weekend! )

Pete

 

Hear hear, Scott!! As I work in the industry, and specifically have been tasked (recently) with doing some market intelligence work I can absolutely say this industry is in HUGE trouble. There's no hyperbole to that statement right now - the barbarians are truly at the gates. And those barbarians are uninformed (such as the legislator that decided to support a CAFE increase because her DIC said her Buick was getting 35mpg), and determined (such as CARB). No discussion is going to turn these folks around - global warming is their standard and we in the industry are the enemy.

However, I don't see this as "sky is falling" time, rather the reverse. The gauntlet has been thrown down and technology and being smarter than the barbarians will win the day. We can succeed, and prosper, but only by being smarter and faster. I'm thrilled to hear that GM possesses no illusions about the situation or the way to prevail. A new and awesome Camaro is important, but the fact that GM wants the car to succeed on so many levels and across so many demographics is energizing. All you guys keep it up!!!

 

I think there are a couple of things that must not be lost sight of:

1) If Someone feels that GM "got it right", that is not the same thing as "getting it perfect". There is always room for improvement.

2) The focus group members are indeed very passionate about this car - and are just as passionate about doing everything possible that could help with its success... so "having already put the deposit down" in one's mind does not necessarily preclude the ability to remain objective. As enthusiasts, we understand the car and its intent - perhaps more acutely than Mustang or import owners could. As a result, we are more closely tuned into the subtleties of the car. After this past weekend, it was obvious to me that there were a few subtle details about the car that we thought could be improved upon. I remain skeptical that non-enthusiasts would have actually noticed these things.

3) I believe GM has held other focus groups for this car (comprised of people who were non-enthusiasts) and gleaned what they could from them. This is a somewhat different tack that GM is taking - i.e. receiving input from its enthusiast community... and from all impressions, the team seems to be very pleased with the contributions made from this group.

Best regardSS,

Elie

 

This is a really good point. The Camaro Nation is probably both the easiest AND hardest consumer group to attract to this car. Easy because we all share a passion about the Camaro and want one in our driveways ASAP. Hardest because we're going to be the most critical of the car. We're the ones that want it this way or that way. We're the ones that are going to analyze every single thing about this car over, and over, and over. But it also needs to appeal to current Mustang or import owners so that when those leases are up or they're ready to purchase a new car, the 2010 Camaro is one of those cars they're thinking about. To echo what Chris said, one of the keys to the success of this car will be conquest sales.

 

Heh, heh... definitely a few hard launches and some opportunities to get a feel for the level of steering response - more so than attempting to generate high G-forces. Cars felt very well-planted around the sweeper-type curves. I kept adding throttle gradually and they just plain hunkered down, demonstrating no body roll and were very confidence-inspiring... aqll at normal highway speeds. Can't say that I hammered the brakes and both V8s were autos.
'Fast Lines' submissions need to be in by the 2nd Monday of the month - too late for June.
Great to hear your car is back together again! Have fun this weekend! I'm out on the Mosport GP track on Friday - can't wait!!

Best regardSS,

Elie

 

Good points Elie but as Bob pointed out earlier, the focus group sounds absolutely drunk with delight in the podcast and posts. It's easy for someone on the outside looking in to be concerned about the groups objectivity. I would bet that if Chevy but a Camaro badge on an Cobalt, someone from the focus group would say "Hey it's an appropriate Camaro for the times - they got it right".

With respect to the makeup of the disciples, they comprised mainly of 4th genners. Yes, you will all come back and say I used to own this or that and that's fine but it is quite different to speak to the guys who can rhyme off part numbers from everything under the hood with their eyes closed.

1st gen hard core lives on Camaros.net. and Yenko.net. 2nd gen hard core live on nastyz28.com. 3rd gen hard core live on thirdgen.org yet none of those sites were approached for a focus group.

These people are just as enthusiastic as we are when it comes to the Camaro but they would have been able to give a perspective that none here gave.

 

Just LOOKING at the 5th-gen, I don't think they needed any more input from the 1st-gen crowd!!

(I'm not saying that as a negative, just being facetious ).

 

Lol!

 

That's cool. Did it FEEL heavy??

Hmm, that's too bad . I guess they didn't want to steal some of the appeal from the V6?

Yeah, nice to have it up and running again. The Strano suspension feels GREAT so far . Hey GM! Why couldn't you have installed this level of suspension right from the factory?!?!?!

I would like to do this Friday's lapping @ Mosport, but I'll be doing last-minute prep for Saturday & Sunday's events .

 

Well, if they were to go to Nasty, I know that some of them would have just peed on the car as they dont seem to be a big fan of it. Most of them are pretty hard core about teh Challenger. Every Camaro thread there seems to turn into a "another GM POS trying to get old people to buy it, they didnt do as good as Mustang or Challenger, it looks like a new Caddy" response.
Dunno about the first gen guys, but they cant be too far off that. As for TGO...you cant ask a question there anyway, you will get banned for 2 weeks. Post a picture along with it and thats a month long ban.

I know on my local board for NJ, its a 50/50 split.
My opinion about the 5th gen is that they should probably get input from people that will buy the car, not just people passing by. The Camaro is a stop-traffic design either way, so people will look and drool and probably dont care too much how it drives but that it sounds good, feels good, and isnt too expensive while being good on gas.
The little things need to be tuned in by people that will buy this car. A bunch of people talking about how they would buy the Challenger over Camaro just based on looks without anything else is perfect example of the difference between what Challenger is vs what Camaro is going to be.

 

ARE YOU OUT OF YOUR MIND! I'd have smashed a fire extingusiher repeatedly over it if thats what they showed us.

Lets see... of the group, four currently own 1st gens. Four currently own 2nd gens. Four currently own 3rd gens. Seven own more than one Camaro. One member has 9 Camaros of all generations.

One is a 1st gen judge at the Camaro Nationals at Carlisle, the largest Camaro show in the nation. Remember the Camaro Heritage tour? His 67 Pace Car and 68 convertible were both in it. Cars he personally restored.

Two members own restoration/repair shops - both specializing in Camaro.

I can hear the air coming out of your arguement from here.

 

Ahaha...that would have been a funny joke for them to play on you guys. A Cobalt with some minor revisions, and a Camaro badge on the back of it.


Sounds like a Camaro die-hard club there.

 

Ya know, I realized one thing NONE of us mentioned. They had a 4th car there for us to drive. A C6 Z06. So perhaps that will put things into perspective on the impressoin the 5th gen made on us.

 

Truth be told, the first slide showing us the day's agenda had the following bullet item

Aveo/Impala test drives.