Damn skippy. Algore said so.

 

I don't think that Ford has the money to make half the changes to the Mustang you listed after seeing the half assed "refreashed" 09 F-150. If they can't spend the money on the truck that pays the bills despite it quickly being a back of the pack performer...I don't see them selling a ton on the Mustang that will sell well as long as they put a horse in the grill.

I get so tired of people whining about weight and the Camaro. How many people say...man this car is 200lbs too heavy...no way I am buying it. Handling and performance is more than just weight. An M3 coupe with an assload of aluminum that is too expensive for the Camaro steill weighs 3650lbs. I would say for the Camaro to be 150-200lbs of that is acceptable.

 

I agree. For me it's not much of a stretch to imagine all the young people who I see driving V6 Mustangs, considering a turbo 4 Genesis for about the same price. The very same people which GM would like to get into a base Camaro.

 

Umm, that would be me....

 

The same person who wanted a Colorado based breadwagon? You are a die hard enthusiast for sure, but not an example of the buyer that Camaro needs to win over.

Honestly, if it looks hot, and turns people on they will buy it. I have a Camaro die cast in my office, and every day someone who walks in stops to look at it and tell me how hot the new Camaro is. That sells cars...not a 200lb weight difference.

 

Oh, you mean a Colorado based Nomad? Not sure I really make the connection here on that.

Anyway, a hot looking car gets people noticing, and some people will buy simply for that reason alone. However, in a limited volume segment - where EVERY PLAYER has a hot looking car - looks alone makes you nothing more than an also ran.


This weight thing you bring up Branden, is so damned important. And I don't mean the obvious acceleration, handling, braking and steering metrics - where every pound you add, flushes abit more of all of those good things down the crapper.

I'm talking about CAFE for one. Let me guaranfreakintee you, if Camaro comes in overweight, it WILL absolutely still meet CAFE no matter what it takes. Even if getting there now means a 2.29 rear gear, 100 less horsepower and less displacement to make up for that extra weight.

It'll be the same story for emissions, which BTW, will be getting much tougher early next decade. More mass equals more emissions. It WILL pass emissions - you can figure out the rest.

200 pounds? Yeah, I'm sure plenty of people won't care, and you've just declared yourself as being one of them. But that extra 200 lbs will make the difference between Camaro being a class leader in performance, efficiency and street cred, or just another stylish coupe in a very crowded field.

 

Hyundai released them to Car and Driver. 3500.

 

The G37 platform recieved extra strengthening bars in Coupe form. The 4 door G37 is actually 100 pounds lighter. The highly disguised Z-car that's been seen testing alongside Z4 Coupes and Caymans is more than 9 inches shorter than the 350Z, which is in turn significantly shorter than the G37 Coupe. Nissan of Japan already admitted that while the Z performs well, it's too heavy compared with it's competition, and made weight savings THE priority for the next Z-car. They're also concerned about the G37 cannibalizing sales of the Z-car, since they're essentially the same car, and it makes sense that they would make the difference between the two as large as possible with the upcoming generation. Hence: Significantly smaller, lighter and less practical. An enthusiasts car. You want a GT? Get the G37. That's the strategy.

 

Within 150-200lbs of the M3 equals 3800-3850lbs. Completely unacceptable, would never purchase it if it were that heavy. Not a chance.....don't care what it does in the quarter or on the skidpad. It won't feel great while it does it at that weight.

The M3 is heavy cuz they're using a silly high tech V-8 which weighs a lot, putting tons of sound deadening material in it, running stupid-big wheels, and have it loaded with like 40 airbags and a ridiculous amount of "luxury" equipment. The CSL version will be much better, probably 200 pounds lighter, since it gets rid of the crap. The camaro needs to be under 3700lbs.

Will it sell great if it comes in at a higher weight but keeps the awesome styling? Yep, it will. I don't care. I won't pay for it. How many copies of the car I own a company is able to move doesn't matter to me at all.

Here's hoping Fbodyfather and the guys at Chevy can keep the weight in check, because I'd love to have the new Camaro. But I simply will lose all interest if it's an overweight porker.

 

I have to agree with Brandon that so long as the car looks good and handled well, the average buyer won't care if it weighs 3500 lbs or 3900 lbs.

I'll care....a lot. I'm sure others will to. But the masses won't, IMHO. For evidence, consider that they don't seem to care that Mustang only makes 300 HP, still uses a live axle, and doesn't ever perform up to the level of a 1998 Camaro - its logical competition.

Sad (from my perspective) but likely true.

Bob

 

To add to the above post about the so-called Mustang competitor from Hyundai - Info from the 01/09 Car and Driver:

Engine: DOHC V6, 231 CI/3.78L
Power: 300 hp
Torque: 263 lbs.
0-60: 5.9
WB: 111 in.
Lg: 182.3
Width: 73.4
Ht: 54.3

The article says 25k for the base model, but it's kind of confusing as to whether it's the base V6 or the base four cylinder 200 plus hp.

I really don't see this as a competitor to a V8 Camaro, but it may be for the base Camaro. Hell, my 1997 V6 Camaro had 200 hp ten years ago, and my current stock 97 LT1 Z28 does 0-60 in at least 6 seconds.

Having said all that, it's a pretty ugly car to me.

 

GREAT! Now Toyota is throwing Saturn Sky's off of buildings to sell trucks?

 

I'm thinking that's a misprint on the cost of the base model.

 

I chalk that up to the fact that Mustang has been unencumbered by any direct competition for the past half decade.

 

^ I saw a commercial for 3K back or "off" all GT mustangs.... that makes a GT only 23K. If I wasn't waiting for a Camaro I'd probably get me a GT this month. I LOVE the '05+ mustangs. I'd buy a windevil blue GT with a 5 speed and white stripes.

Anyway, my point, sales must have slowed, not a good sign... slowing sales and too many new offerings. Meh, like I said, I'll still have mine