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Old 11-28-2005 | 12:22 PM
  #31  
gmcvt's Avatar
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Re: GMs camaro problem

Originally Posted by UtOhCop
If it sells so great. Why did GM cut production for 05? Exactly.

The Mustang sells 100K units a year but the GTO can barely sell 12K.
Several reasons.
1. They only intended to build 18,000 the first year.
2. The GTO price is more expensive than the 100,000 units
of Mustangs Ford sells.
3. Poor marketing on GM's part and some say styling thats too subdued.

This year, if you have kept up with it, the sales of the Goat have been much
better. I think the visual enhancements helped along with the fact that people began to see the car in person are were much more impressed with it.
Old 11-28-2005 | 12:22 PM
  #32  
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Re: GMs camaro problem

Originally Posted by UtOhCop
If it sells so great. Why did GM cut production for 05? Exactly.

The Mustang sells 100K units a year but the GTO can barely sell 12K.
Several reasons.
1. They only intended to build 18,000 the first year.
2. The GTO price is more expensive than the 100,000 units
of Mustangs Ford sells.
3. Poor marketing on GM's part and some say styling thats too subdued.

This year, if you have kept up with it, the sales of the Goat have been much
better. I think the visual enhancements helped along with the fact that people began to see the car in person are were much more impressed with it.

As to production cut, it was my understanding that they didn't intend on building
as many 05's in the first place. The production didn't start till late, as to the exact date I would have to refer you to ls1gto.com and they could tell you.

Last edited by gmcvt; 11-28-2005 at 12:24 PM.
Old 11-28-2005 | 01:16 PM
  #33  
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Re: GMs camaro problem

The biggest reason they need to offer a V6 is, Insurance...The younger buyers, who can help promote this new Camaro bigtime, need affordable insurance. Not to mention, parents will buy a 6 before an 8 for them, b/c of perception, same power or not.
And with it down on torque compared to the LSx's, it'll be more forgiving, when they stab the throttle!..
And they can sell more affordable, non-Z rated wheel/tire/suspension combo's on them, making them more affordable, and more all season freindly.
Old 11-28-2005 | 02:01 PM
  #34  
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Re: GMs camaro problem

Originally Posted by 90rocz
The biggest reason they need to offer a V6 is, Insurance...The younger buyers, who can help promote this new Camaro bigtime, need affordable insurance. Not to mention, parents will buy a 6 before an 8 for them, b/c of perception, same power or not.
Younger buyers don't deserve a new Camaro. I couldn't afford the insurance on a Camaro until I turned 30, so I waited. Let them wait or buy used.

But, if mommy and daddy can afford to buy junior a new Camaro, then mommy and daddy can afford the additional insurance on a V8.
Old 11-28-2005 | 04:41 PM
  #35  
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Re: GMs camaro problem

There are plenty of kids out there who just love these cars. I bought my first camaro (79 z 350/4-speed) when I was 15 years old. Then when i was a sr. in highschool I bought a 95 z. It was 4 years old but it was new to me. It was easy to pay for because cars were all I ever wanted to spend money on. Today I have a few more bills but I still have the 95 and I am looking to build a stroker for it and I will still buy a new Z as soon as they come to town no matter what state farm says.
Old 11-28-2005 | 06:40 PM
  #36  
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Re: GMs camaro problem

Originally Posted by jg95z28
Younger buyers don't deserve a new Camaro. I couldn't afford the insurance on a Camaro until I turned 30, so I waited. Let them wait or buy used.

HEY!!!!!!!!!! i've had 4 F-bodys so far and i'm only 25, and i paid every dime of insurance on all of them
Old 11-28-2005 | 06:50 PM
  #37  
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Re: GMs camaro problem

Originally Posted by gmcvt
As to production cut, it was my understanding that they didn't intend on building
as many 05's in the first place. The production didn't start till late, as to the exact date I would have to refer you to ls1gto.com and they could tell you.
Not only didn't it start until late, but they cut it early so they could start 06 production early to line up with the model years. That's why they cut sales back to 12k for 05.

Chris
Old 11-28-2005 | 06:55 PM
  #38  
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From: Franklin Park, NJ, USA
Re: GMs camaro problem

Originally Posted by jg95z28
Younger buyers don't deserve a new Camaro. I couldn't afford the insurance on a Camaro until I turned 30, so I waited. Let them wait or buy used.
I bought my 2000 Camaro V6 brand new when I was 20, my 2002 Trans Am WS6 brand new when I was 21 and my 2004 GTO brand new at 24.

And I paid for all of them myself. I couldn't afford the V8 when I got the Camaro so I got the V6. It was a nice option I was quite happy with and is one of the reasons I ended up in a V8. If it hadn't been available who knows what I would have been driving. V6 is necessary.

Chris
Old 11-28-2005 | 07:12 PM
  #39  
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Re: GMs camaro problem

Younger buyers don't deserve a new Camaro. I couldn't afford the insurance on a Camaro until I turned 30, so I waited. Let them wait or buy used.

But, if mommy and daddy can afford to buy junior a new Camaro, then mommy and daddy can afford the additional insurance on a V8.
I hear you, I got married barely in my 20's, and couldn't afford it either.
But some, in their 20's, live at home, don't pay any bills, buy new cars and modd 'em like crazy.
And I knew more than a few guys in high school, who got a new Camaro/Firebird for graduation...I wasn't so lucky tho.
Old 11-28-2005 | 07:26 PM
  #40  
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Re: GMs camaro problem

Originally Posted by UtOhCop
I wonder if the F-Body would still be around today if they had used the Blown 3800 in the F-Body's from 98 on.
Im guessing that there would be no way it would still be around, because the engines had absolutely no bearing on the cars demise. GM simply didnt do anything to keep the car around anymore, cuz they didnt really want it.
Old 11-28-2005 | 08:56 PM
  #41  
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Re: GMs camaro problem

Originally Posted by motorman
GMs big problem with a new camaro is CAFE. GM can not build any more cars which will hurt the CAFE because they need to sell big SUVs that also hurt their CAFE but adds profit to their bottom line. fords mustangs do not hurt ford that much because they sell a lot of V-6 ones but you can bet that if GM comes out with a camaro most all buyers will want the LS-2 or bigger engine because to most people the camaro is the poor mans corvette
Car CAFE and truck/SUV CAFE are 2 different regulations.

I think when you have a 190 mph Corvette that gets 30mpg on the highway, and a 3700 pound, 400 horse GTO that gets better fuel economy than the top Honda Accord V6, I don't think CAFE numbers are a big problem.
Old 11-29-2005 | 03:39 AM
  #42  
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Re: GMs camaro problem

Originally Posted by motorman
GMs big problem with a new camaro is CAFE. GM can not build any more cars which will hurt the CAFE because they need to sell big SUVs that also hurt their CAFE but adds profit to their bottom line. fords mustangs do not hurt ford that much because they sell a lot of V-6 ones but you can bet that if GM comes out with a camaro most all buyers will want the LS-2 or bigger engine because to most people the camaro is the poor mans corvette

wrong.......

INteresting Tidbit....the LS1 engines in the 98-02 Camaro and Firebird were CAFE Positive...which means they HELPED the corp. hit numbers.

What makes you think EPA numbers will go backward on a 5th gen?

Ever hear of "Displacement on Demand?"

Further, CAFE Average for Trucks/SUVs is separate from passenger cars.

This thread is the stuff that "urban legends" is made of!

(not to flame you.......I just don't think you understand CAFE and fuel economy figures that the LSx engines are capable of....)
Old 11-29-2005 | 07:04 AM
  #43  
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From: neverneverland
Re: GMs camaro problem

Originally Posted by Red Planet
wrong.......

INteresting Tidbit....the LS1 engines in the 98-02 Camaro and Firebird were CAFE Positive...which means they HELPED the corp. hit numbers.

What makes you think EPA numbers will go backward on a 5th gen?

Ever hear of "Displacement on Demand?"

Further, CAFE Average for Trucks/SUVs is separate from passenger cars.

This thread is the stuff that "urban legends" is made of!

(not to flame you.......I just don't think you understand CAFE and fuel economy figures that the LSx engines are capable of....)
The question is: Will GM actually start putting DOD on their high tune engines?
Old 11-29-2005 | 07:41 AM
  #44  
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From: West Middlesex, pa, usa
Re: GMs camaro problem

Originally Posted by guionM
Car CAFE and truck/SUV CAFE are 2 different regulations.

I think when you have a 190 mph Corvette that gets 30mpg on the highway, and a 3700 pound, 400 horse GTO that gets better fuel economy than the top Honda Accord V6, I don't think CAFE numbers are a big problem.
The GTO gets better milage than a V6 Accord?
Old 11-29-2005 | 08:59 AM
  #45  
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Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 1,512
From: Miami, FL, US
Re: GMs camaro problem

Originally Posted by Red Planet
wrong.......

INteresting Tidbit....the LS1 engines in the 98-02 Camaro and Firebird were CAFE Positive...which means they HELPED the corp. hit numbers.

What makes you think EPA numbers will go backward on a 5th gen?

Ever hear of "Displacement on Demand?"

Further, CAFE Average for Trucks/SUVs is separate from passenger cars.

This thread is the stuff that "urban legends" is made of!

(not to flame you.......I just don't think you understand CAFE and fuel economy figures that the LSx engines are capable of....)
the man has spoken! so it is safe to say that the next gen Camaro will have "Displacement on Demand".



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