HAZ-Matt

Aren't the ram air hoods on the SS and WS6s composite and weight less than the base hoods?

BigDarknFast

Unlike you, I will miss the current GTO and am glad it was offered. My GTO is the best muscle car I've ever had, on several levels. Quality, power/tq, safety, overall road performance, and value... it has it all. (BTW my reference to the four bucket seats - they were an upgrade over my LT1 Formula's hodge-podge combo rear seat and along with the great rear legroom and rear seat visibility for my two boys, were a big reason I got the car).

Overpriced? I got mine during the employee-price-for-anyone special last fall. It ended up being around $29k (had about $1k in GM Mastercard rebates too) before sales tax. Seemed like a screaming deal to me, for a roomy four-seat 400HP IRS RWD coupe. And it still gives me that stupid grin every time the LS2 winds up past 6000 RPM

RussStang

That depends on what your defintion of "off" is. I have known far too many fbody owners who have weighed their cars on actual scales to know that no stock coupe fbody weighs 3577lbs. If I need to, I can come up with an abundance of internet links from actual owners to prove my point. I don't even know of a car review site that lists an non vert 4th gen fbody weight that high.

It seems like Guy is trying to soften the blow of what the 5th gen might weigh in by giving bloated 4th gen weight figures to make the two cars weight seem more comparable.

RussStang

The problem is, you are pulling many of these numbers out of the air. Thanks for the last sentence you typed though, it was just the perfect level of condescending. Why exact would a fiberglass SS hood weigh more than a z28s? Why exact would a fully loaded SS weigh more than a fully loaded z28 at all? What other options did the SS have, besides bigger wheels? You are assuming that the auto cars weigh more as well, which from what I understand is the contrary. I will get back to you on this.

*Here are some quick links I just pulled up off of this very board about curb weight

http://web.camaross.com/forums/showt...ht=curb+weight
Refer post 8
Refer post 21 (probably dry car though)
Refer post 24

http://web.camaross.com/forums/showt...ht=curb+weight
Refer post 24 (about the stripper car)

http://www.bfranker.badz28.com/fbody/weights.htm
Scroll down alittle on this page. According to this guys research, an LS1 with auto weighs LESS than an LS1 with t56.

I will see what else I can come up with.

Bob Cosby

LOL, I'm sort of not able to go this year anyway (a bit predisposed), but do want to try and make it in 07 or 08.

Scott....you should try running for Political office somewhere.

Mark....good way of putting it.

Bob

QATransAm

Again....My fully loaded SS....leather, t-tops, cd changer, whatever "crap" i'm missing....weighs 3400...actually it was 3390 to be exact! i'm not just looking at some article, i weighed the thing myself...

And going back to the cobra thing...i seriously doubt we'll see many full weight 07's taking out slightly or whatever modded 03/04's...last i checked 03's are blown...yet theres still a 300-400lbs difference

what does this mean to me? and you're right it may only be important to a few of us...
I don't want the camaro to have the same problem...

If i pull up to a 5th gen, or race one at the strip...i wanna get absolutely killed! I want to be forced into buying a new one...i remember when i only had my 3rd gen, and i would try to keep up with 4ths it just couldn't be done. It made me go out and get the 4ths that i have.

Its only concern guys, thats it...i'm not trying to rip the car, or those that have and are currently working very hard on it. I don't look at a car, and want it for its looks...its not the old days, its just plastic to me. I want to WANT the car...know what i mean?

BigDarknFast

I'm not exactly sure how 'off' - although I do see edmunds.com listed the curb weight of an 02 Z28 coupe at 3439 lb (BTW they also list the curbweight of an 02 Trans Am at 3499). Having accomplished a T-top conversion myself on my LT1 Formula, I also agree with GuionM's judgement that t-tops add a little... 12-disk changers add a little... big wheels and fat 275 tires add a little... maybe even the SS muffler adds a little (I used to get them from hawksthirdgenparts.com for all my 4gen fbodies since they are an excellent muffler)... and so on. So it wouldn't surprise me to discover an A4 02 SS coupe curb weight at about 3500 or even more. And let's talk about size. The 02 Z28 was 193x74x51 in (LxWxH). The 5gen CONCEPT is approx 186x80x53 and it's been rumored herein that the production greenhouse will be a little taller, although GM has also said the production car will be 'virtually identical' to the concept. These dimensions and observations are what lead me to conclude the 5gen will be slightly heavier than the 4gen. I also still maintain though... most buyers (not the highly vocal racer crew here on this forum) put looks, functionality and features above petit curb weight in their priority list.

I had that feeling too, going from my LT1 Formula to my 05 GTO. I had a K&N and headers on my Formula and it was a blast to drive. But one drive in an 05 GTO and I knew I had to have one despite it being heavier. The IRS flew over bumps and uneven roads, where my 4gen's would do that annoying 'truck ride dance'. The GTO has 400 hp/tq, more than compensating for a little more heft (in fact even with my lousy track skills, my 05 GTO is quicker at the track than the 02 TA I had). Higher quality... speedo in DIC and other ergonomic improvements... vastly improved headlights, seats, exhaust note... all were more important to me than whether my car would also be a little more hefty.

Bob Cosby

What is "petit" to one might be a bit more meaningful to others. That doesn't make them right or wrong - just different. I agree 100% that most will put looks (ESPECIALLY looks), functionality (the least of the three) and features above - well above - curb weight.

The fact that I'm not one of those doesn't preclude me from making my statements.

And I'll say again...you can continue to add HP to at least partially make up for increases in weight (02 TA to 05 GTO is a shining example), but that doesn't change my arguement in the least. If it did, I'd probably be singing the praises of the 2007 Shelby - which will have no problem at all with your 200 lb lighter GTO.

Bob

PS...my 99 T/A (loaded, of course, as they all were) was 3660 lbs with me in it. Being just a bit generous, that would make it 3480 lbs w/o me and with ~1/4 tank of gas.

SSbaby

I was worried that VE piling on 250lbs was going to hurt its performance and handling. My concerns were unfounded as VE is the fastest and best handling Holden Commodore EVER... and by a big margin. The extra chassis stiffness endow's the car with so much more composure and the 50:50 f-r weight distribution and short overhangs also play a major role in aiding handling.

Personally, I find this talk of obesity rather pointless as Camaro is designed off the same platform as VE with arguably more favourable dimensions (given it's a 2 door) for performance/handling. I reckon GM will make this Camaro the best ever.. in every respect. I have faith.

I just don't know if I can hold out until 2009 as VE is soooo tempting!!!

91_z28_4me

Guy your getting yourself worked up over this. Just let them believe what they want to believe. If they have scales and weighing measurements that take off weight it will do the same for the 5th gen.

BigDarknFast

You've every right to your statements, and they definitely should be considered by folks like FBodFather (and I'm sure they are). I agree 100%, it's better all round to take off weight than to add power/brakes/fuel, at least from an ENGINEERING perspective. Overall though, the law of diminishing returns steps in quickly - where saving a few more pounds (just being arbitrary - say, trying to get below 3650 lb curb) requires extreme measures in either cost or in sacrificing features people will be demanding in 2009 (eg, muscular quarter panels, ABS, mean-looking wheels/tires, etc).

Bob Cosby

Generally speaking, and given that I'm not an engineer in any way, shape, or form, I concur.

Detente' is a wonderful thing.

Bob

STOCK1SC

My 1SC 2002 stripper Z28 weighed in at 3340lbs so they weren't that heavy if configured correctly, too bad you won't be able to get another one with the new style. Although rolling up the passenger side window at 70mph was both painful and dangerous!

guionM

Naw. Not getting worked up on this. Probally sounds that way since you can only type words but not convey tone or anything else when you're making a point.

I've learned long ago that no matter what the facts are, people are going to believe whatever they want. When you post actual GM numbers and you still get people in denial, then it's best to leave them in their fantasy and move on.

So......
No guys, T-tops weigh nothing.

GM is wrong... automatics really are lighter than manuals.

Big 275 tires on 17 inch rims weigh the same as smaller rims and tires.

Leather is no different in weight than cloth.... even though comparing leather & cloth jackets say otherwise.

Fairy pixie dust made the SS hood & tubing lighter than the standard Z28.

Sure, I picked those numbers out of thin air... everything really weighs nothing.

Certain people were magically blessed with loaded Z28s and Camaro SS that weighs less than what GM's official weight for a base model, no optioned, Z28 hardtop.

There. That should make everyone feel better.

(Not said in a tone of anger or frustration... said in a tone of someone chuckling to themself as they go along with whatever it is that crazy uncle says, just so they can move along to something else more worthwile.... )

BigDarknFast

For some reason, I'm not going to hold my breath waiting

I wonder how accurate some of these scales are, peeps keep quoting from. I'm sorry but I tend to put more credence in specs put out by GM and by official references like edmunds.com.