You need to practice some reading comprehension, and then reread the poll. Look real hard, and you might notice that there is no mention of a 430hp engine.

As Pete mentioned, the LS engines don't have an aluminum intake. Obviously you don't know you engines very well either.

 

I have seen many a Beer Gut that adds more weight than the addition of a Supercharger.

 

Wow, I'd have to say that's a whole lot of beer. Maybe time for an intervention.

At any rate, those massive beer guts have "mid engine" placement and aren't over the front wheels.

 

And they have a fluid c.g. that can help put the weight where it's needed, when it's needed!

 

You left the ***** on the hvac intact? Shesh man....what kind of weight **** are you?

 

thats not the same as saying they both will make 500 horses. you are using guesstimates as HP numbers. if chevy can make nearly the same horses without the blower, then they will. if they want more ponies, they will use a blower. period. i guarantee that if they come out with a NA motor and a FI motor as an option, the FI motor will have enough horses in it to make the project worth while. thats all ive got so say about it.

And to capn pete.....my bad on the intake, i forgot that they are poly. im used to my LT1's intake, and then when i think of the LS intake i just have the aluminum weiand and BBK aftermarket pieces stuck in my head.

but i honestly cant see the blower weighing in at anywhere near 100 pounds. im not too familiar with positive displacement blowers but from what i can remember the only thing that would be needed to drive it is a double crank pulley and a tensioner pulley. my centrifugal blower needs a large bracket to mount it and id say that it probably weighs 30 pounds with the bracket on it. i know most people think that the centrifugal blowers are small and light, but they are acutally a pretty large piece. i dont see a pos. disp. blower even weighing twice that of a centrifugal.

as for the aftermarket horsepower.....i know you can do a reliable cam and head swap with no problem (even though usually not as street friendly). but the majority of the people who will want a new camaro (people who are not into camaros enough to be a member on a forum like this) will not even think about digging into their motor for more power, nor will they pay the big bucks to have a pro do a heads/cam upgrade. and doing an aftermarket SC upgrade is costly and the motor wont be made to handle boost.

AND you have guys who live in california who still have that dark smog cloud looming over our heads. we are quite limited on what we can do and still make those pesky smog machines happy.

i truely hope that they come out with a NA powerhouse so that i can do a cam and head swap, because if they do come out with a FI car, then it will cheapen the value of the HP. any joe who doesnt know the first think about whats under his hood will still have assloads of power. but, if they do produce a FI car with assloads of power, i will be very temped to buy that car and do the common pulley, intake and tune upgrade. oh and id have to through on some Meth injection too.....

i dont know man, im just gonna wait and see what my real options are from GM when they are actually availible.

oh, and for the NA activists, i do NOT like that stupid blower whine that the positive displacement blowers make. and the SC motors dont make much more power than the NA cars at lower rpm. its not till that blower gets turnin that you really start getting some real power. maybe the pos. dis. blowers make a different type of power but my vortech blower doesnt really start making the motor rip unitll about 3K, and the more rpm, the harder that SOB pulls. it makes you not want to shift it. thats why boost is addictive.

 

That's EXACTLY the premise here.

So when a developement engineer says that the Gen V 6.2L prototype is making “well north of 450 hp (on gasoline)” , and that's normally aspirated and in truck form - and the Leftlane story says that the SC's LS8 is in the 475 -500 hp range - you don't see that as being in the same ballpark power wise?

 

I sort of see ss#1230s points. The weight factor will be greatly influenced by block material, which I think Bob Cosby already pointed out.

Additionally I think you make a good point about the power output of these theoretical motors. I do not know what sort of valvetrain technology would be in this theoretical 500HP naturally aspirated motor, but I would have to assume that if the displacement is much less than the 7L LS7 it would need at the least VVT to meet emissions and idle quality whilst making 500HP.

If the supercharged motor is similar in displacement with similar valvetrain it will make more power... probably on the order of say 40% more power at 7psi of boost. That is unless they put a 20mm throttle body on it or really cork up the exhaust.

If the theory was that the SC motor was really going to be a GenIV and have vastly inferior valvetrain and heads compared to this hypothetical NA motor than perhaps the power values could be similar. But if the architectures are more similar than there really isn't much that they can do to make a factory NA motor match a factory blower motor short of more displacement. All in all if that GenV is making "well north of 450HP" which may or may not be anywhere from 451hp-1000hp, than that is great. However that 475HP number for a supercharged LS8 has always seemed a bit on the low side to me.

 

That ain't my car! In addition to the various *****, I sure as hell wouldn't of left the stock seat in it!

 

I agree totally. The Gen V will be available in 6.2L, have VVT, GDI, and any number of additional new technologies which I can only guess at. It will certainly have the potential to have head/valvetrain configurations heretofore unseen by us. From what I gather, the Gen V will be every bit the technological leap forward from the Gen IV, as the LS1 was to the LT1.

I guess a good analogy to this would be like asking, would you prefer a 345hp NA LS1 or a 345hp blown LT1.

 

thanks haz-matt. i think you read the whole post, which i dont believe everyone does before making their rebuttals.

if they have the technology to make a "500hp" motor, that is fuel efficient, emissions friendly, and cost effective to build (which the 500hp LS7 is not), then they will use it. and if the threw a blower on that motor, well then id guess it would probably make more power...right? or does forced induction not add power?

oh, and IMHO, we can forget about them making a mass produced 6.2L engine revving to 7000.

 

There is currently a 6.2 engine in mass production that revs to 6600 rpm. You may have heard of it.... the LS3.

Is a future engine capable of 6800 or 7000 rpm really so unthinkable?

Also if this current "normal" NA engine can make 435 hp then a DI NA engine would surely be capable of damn near 500hp. I'll say 475 to put a number on it.

Maybe I need to spell it out....

Not all of us drag race.
Some of us want our cars to handle.
Some of us understand what affects the handling of a car.

 

well then it sounds like the "cone killer" is all you need...

if your into autocross, wouldnt you be better off getting a smaller car that is more suited to that type of driving? i know that it is a popular sport for f-bodies and vettes, but i wouldnt think that you would even begin to tap into the power of a V8 car (even a stocker).

but if you are into autocross, i can definately see why you would not want any more weight than what your already dealing with. but with a faster type of racing (fast road courses and open road races) you could benefit from more power.

depending on what type of racing and how serious a person is about it will determine what kinda car one needs. im sure GM will do its best to find a ballance to make everyone happy.....

 

I'd be lying if I said the thought has never occurred to me....
... but the challenge of trying to harness the big brute's potential is why autocrossing them is so damn fun and is also why I haven't jumped ship to another more "suitable" car.



If you can drive these big cars through the cones in a competent manner, then you can drive most any car. Attend a national SOLO event sometime.... F Stock, E Street Prepared and C Prepared put on quite a show.

I fully intend to replace my '96 ESP car with a 5th gen FS car provided the car is competitive with the current and future Mustang variants. If it's carrying extra baggage on the nose, it won't be competitive.

 

I'm sure the GenV will be pretty awesome too, and I bet they can make a 6.XL motor make 500HP with VVT/DI/3valve and still meet the requirements of a factory motor. It probably will still rev to about 6500 I would imagine, but I guess they could make the cam a little more aggressive with the VVT... or if it is a twin in block cam then who knows how different it would be.

Perhaps what is bothering me most about the scenario is really the SC motor. It doesn't seem to me that it makes much sense to even develop a supercharged version of a lame duck architecture unless it is coming out very soon. But if we pretend that these motors are going to be essentially LS3s with a blower slapped on then I still think the power output should be at least 500HP. Even just a 30% boost in power to the LS3 would make a 550HP motor.

I don't even want to know how much power you would make with a 6L VVT supercharged motor with direct injection. Maybe it would be the >600HP that the BlueDevil/ZR1 motor makes