I guess he forgets the many years back to 1964 yje V6 Mustang has sold very well if not better than the V8 many years.

My question is will you promote in advertising that disciples were consulted to built the car for the people and not just a buch of old guys in Detroit telling us what we want. Mr Lutz excepted.

I could see a American car built for the people and by the people who love this car. Yourself and the other 5th gen crew included.

Also is the tuning byJohn Heinrency going to be promoted in print and TV? THe GM Performance Group is really starting to mean something now with all the qulity tuned suspensions they have now turned out. John is a hands on Sheby to GM and not just a name on the fender.

I know you many not be able to answer if you are doing these things but it would be points that would be good to consider. Even on the V6.

John H's lap time at the Green Hell is what got me to take a drive in the HHR SS. They have turned it into one hell of a ride.

Ypu guys have done what has been needed and this care would not have turned ou this way 10-15 years ago under the old GM. Now it is up to the market and public to show their feelings with their wallet.

 

There was just a post with a link a few weeks ago showing that more than 50% of M*stang sales were V8 and I cannot find it for anything. Nothing posted yet has really convinced me that a good base V8 with similar power and MPG wouldn't be a great seller, the V6's would probably still take up most of the sales. (it was always that way until the later 4th Gen anyway) You cannot compare the rest of the market to cars like Camaros and it's competitors. Of course they have great selling V6's, that's the top engine in most cars today and they don't get lost in the shadow of the V8 models as cars do in this segment.

The V6 5th Gen sounds like a promising car and the V6 car needs to be strong, unfortunately I still think theres a gap left for those that would like a small V8. Then again I guess we don't know exactly what the model lineup will look like yet powerwise and what the pricing will be of the lower V8 car, so maybe this is best left until then.

SilverSS,

I know what you're saying. I guess I'm simply not the target for that car though and a Camaro enthusiast is always gonna try to push the V8 agenda LOL.

 

An important thing i think, to get away from the "just a V6" thing which definetly still exists, is a good exhaust note. Theres nothing worse than a 3rd or 4th gen V6 with 'flows'! Won't say anything about the 2.8 3.1 3.4 motors ugh, the 3800 is a really nice sounding engine, but the minute you put aftermarket exhaust on it its ear wrenching!

In an effort to be positive here, and for whatever my opinion is worth, i think the people buying the V6 should have more to be proud of other than just owning a good looking, quick Camaro. Give them a sound even V8 guys like myself can appreciate, so they don't feel like they're being looked down upon. It happens, all the time...don't care what anyone says! Nissans 3.5 has a really nice sound to it for a six shooter, even with exhaust. So i hope this is one of the things special attention is being paid to, maybe even working with aftermarket companies to develop great alternatives to stock. So instead of that annoying mid range identity crisis sound, how bout a mean pissed off powerful inspiring sound?!?!

I know the above is basically 100% enthusiast based, even though its the base model, i'm sorry Nothing wrong with having even more people who look at their Camaro as more than just a car!

 

If anyone has heard a new CTS with either V6 take off from a start, you will hear the noise it makes and its very nice. They tuned the exhaust to give it a nice sporty tone. Its not as lound as it is on the G35, but it has a nice exhaust note.
BTW...Gen III and up motors arent exactly "sexy" sounding either. They sound nice, but nothing like a Gen I/II.

 

Here is all that I was able to find:

2005 Mustang GT 60,792, Mustang V6 99,620

There is an article from December that says this:

http://www.autoblog.com/2007/12/10/f...n-for-mustang/

 

I think in the first year of a new model or refresh the enthusiast population always bumps the take rate on V8 models and it then dies down a little (excluding the last few years of the 4th gen once "Hey, they ain't gonna make these anymore!" crept in and V8 sales went way up).

Sure, Dodge "sold out" of Challenger SRT8s - 6,400 cars, but that's hardly a mainstream success. I bet once the other models launch, the SE will outsell the R/T in the long run (though maybe not in the first year).

Enthusiasts tend to be early adopters for these cars, but once that market is satiated, you've still got to move a lot of metal to make it worthwhile.

I'm seeing a V6 car in my future and if it has 300 horses and a great suspension, I won't feel like I'm settling for it, either. After all, it will be 100 horses more than my 6.6 Liter 400!

 

Ditto that. My reaction to the V6 was surprising to me, and it has changed my perspective completely. In thinking about dealer allocation, maybe the V6 will not be as hard to get my hands on early on and I'll still have a really fun daily driver that won't be as expensive to keep.

 

I agree and I'll probably go with the V8 and a manual trans too. But it seems like the bar will have been raised for the V6 group and at the end of the day it's a good thing for all of us Camaro fans.

 

His disconnect is that he doesn't understand that GM doesn't need to sell him a Camaro.

He posts on camaross.com... he's probably already considering buying one.

If he realized that GM needs to sell this car to the people who currently buy Nissans, Hondas, and Toyotas he might understand that a great V6 makes more sense than a solid V8.

It would also help if he realized that GM needs to sell a great V6 sport coupe to young buyers who can't/won't afford a V8 in order to get them to consider buying a GM sedan when they start reproducing.

I doubt that argument will make sense to him though. Anybody that thinks this car is/should be designed strictly for GM loyalists is probably not interested in hearing about conquest sales and cross marketing.

 

Sure, they could get similar power and FE from something like the 5.3 LS4 that's in the Impala SS. But IMO there's almost no "sex appeal" there. The HFV6DI is a world class engine, by all reports. It beats most of the import V6s, and it would be great to have an an affordable car.

Also the competition isn't standing still. "My V6 beats your V8" is something they have to avoid at all costs.

 

This is just a different time though from an enthusist standpoint . There are boatloads of younger import minded enthusist who will buy a V6 over the V8 if the car itself is desireable . There are as many people nowadays that would say the VQ 3.5/3.7 in a G35/350/370z or something like the VR6 in a R32 VW sounds better than a LS engine . With some headers , a x-pipe and something like as pair of Corsa touring mufflers the 3.6 will sound amazing .

The GM 3.6 is a great engine with a bright aftermarket future , its a good sounding V6 in the cars Ive driven ( CTS , SRX and G6 ) the car will have a manual trans and apparently will handle to boot . For once the only fault your gonna beable to really give it , is it doent have a V8 .

Even though I would be more inclined to buy a base model with something like a L76 , I think GM did the right thing by going all out on a killer v6 .

 

Show

Me

The

Data.

I want to see it in Black and White -- not your opinion or what you think is true.

Show

Me

The

Data.

 

I know what is being said about the 4th gen V6's. Nothing but a dog, but all indications are
that this V6 is going to be far and away better than those. Yes, it will be looked at initially
as "Oh, only a V6?", but if what we here is true, and from those that have driven it I put
a lot of faith, this V6 is gonna change that stereotype about the engine. I say bring it on
and let's show all the beyotches what this thing can do.

 

Just take a good look at this thread from start to finish.

CamaroZ28.com is probally stuffed full of the most rabid, pro-V8 crowd of any website on the internet. Yet.....

...look at how many people here will readily accept a great performing V6!

There are those who personally prefer a V8, and clearly state that it's their personal preference. I'm not talking about the people living in some alternate universe who still somehow believe that a mid-level V8 is going to outsell a great V6, or that today the public at large still has a facination with V8 engines.

I wrote a thread a long time ago on how I felt that enthusiasts ruined the 4th gen Camaro. How these people hijacked what Camaro really was (a car for a wide variety of people) and turned it into a no compromise, no excuses car.... which promptly failed so miserably that when it died, it stayed dead for over half a dozen years, and we're still waiting for it to return.

What excites me about this new Camaro is that GM seems to have learned it's lesson, and not letting the clueless crazies dictate what Camaro should be. Letting Camaro return to the car us older people remember it to be.

Any idiot can make a car that goes fast. Add horsepower. Go home.

But it takes real effort and comittment to make a car appeal to a wide swath of the buying public. It has to be practical. It has to be well made. It has to be fun to drive. It can be quick, but it can NOT scare the living daylights out of the average driver. It has to offer more value than it's competition. And most of all, it has to be a car that can stand on it's own merits, even without the most powerful engine option. The 4th gen was NOT that way. The 5th gen by every account is.

The performance of the V6 by every account I've read or heard so far is amazing (note... the lack of the disqualifier: "..for a V6"!). I'm getting the feeling that instead of a base afterthought and a hairy knuckled V8, we're also getting a car that betters a G37 coupe at a smaller price, better mileage, and better performance.... yet at a slightly lower weight (so much for calling the Camaro a bulky pig, huh? ).

I can easily see myself getting a V6 6 speed manual Camaro if it's at least as quick as the LT1 was (which the LS1 was barley quicker than till well over 60mph).

I've been bidding my time waiting for the Holden Ute to show up. If GM does just one thing, you can count me in as a almost certain V6 Camaro buyer.... just one thing.....

NO SPEED GOVERNOR!!!!!!!!

With over 300 horsepower from the DI V6, that's going to be a nearly 160 mph V6.

Can't find anything wrong with that!

 

Tell me that I'm wrong.
I can just see this huge smile across your face, Guy.