Cranks long time before starting
08-09-2002, 11:07 AM
#1
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Cranks long time before starting
This is strange. When I put the key in the car it croanks over a few times (excessively long even for a 92) before starting. Almost as though tbe battery were going dead. But even after replacing it, I have the same trouble.
The volt gauge shows a healthy 13.5ish, the car starts every time. It has a new cap and rotor and a new battery.
Any ideas ? battery drain or starter maybe?
And could it be related to the window motor problem (stops working and comes back if you let it sit for a few seconds)
It sounds like the generic old truck in every movie that has to be cranked over 20 times to statr, just in time as the [insert large object here] almost destroys the vehicle and it's occupant.
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James D Montigny
1992 Pontiac Firebird 5.0
Bone Stock Officer, I Swear !
The members of this board are enthusiasts, not experts.
Please consider everything that you read an opinion.
The volt gauge shows a healthy 13.5ish, the car starts every time. It has a new cap and rotor and a new battery.
Any ideas ? battery drain or starter maybe?
And could it be related to the window motor problem (stops working and comes back if you let it sit for a few seconds)
It sounds like the generic old truck in every movie that has to be cranked over 20 times to statr, just in time as the [insert large object here] almost destroys the vehicle and it's occupant.
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James D Montigny
1992 Pontiac Firebird 5.0
Bone Stock Officer, I Swear !
The members of this board are enthusiasts, not experts.
Please consider everything that you read an opinion.
08-09-2002, 11:24 AM
#3
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by angel71rs:
Maybe no fuel or excessive fuel. </font>
Maybe no fuel or excessive fuel. </font>
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James D Montigny
1992 Pontiac Firebird 5.0
Bone Stock Officer, I Swear !
The members of this board are enthusiasts, not experts.
Please consider everything that you read an opinion.
[This message has been edited by James Montigny (edited August 09, 2002).]
08-09-2002, 11:31 AM
#4
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Luckily the boshe replacement part is cheap; but look at that BECK/ARNLEY one 
http://www.partsamerica.com/SelectPa...Code=12661&Sea rchFor=Oxygen+Sensor
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James D Montigny
1992 Pontiac Firebird 5.0
Bone Stock Officer, I Swear !
The members of this board are enthusiasts, not experts.
Please consider everything that you read an opinion.
http://www.partsamerica.com/SelectPa...Code=12661&Sea rchFor=Oxygen+Sensor
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James D Montigny
1992 Pontiac Firebird 5.0
Bone Stock Officer, I Swear !
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08-09-2002, 04:06 PM
#5
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It might have a dripping injector. If it is hard to start after it sits for a while, but starts ok after a short sit, that would be my guess. I've heard you can hydraulic a cylinder if an injector is leaking bad enough.
I know on some injected vehicles, there is a starting injector. If yours has one, injector might be bad or it's relay.
Anybody know if this vehicle uses a starting injector?
I know on some injected vehicles, there is a starting injector. If yours has one, injector might be bad or it's relay.
Anybody know if this vehicle uses a starting injector?
08-09-2002, 05:39 PM
#6
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Either would explain the gassy smell my car has, although it could just be me getting used to what a TBI smells like *shrug* It's not extremely strong like a FPR leak or anything.
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James D Montigny
1992 Pontiac Firebird 5.0
Bone Stock Officer, I Swear !
The members of this board are enthusiasts, not experts.
Please consider everything that you read an opinion.
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James D Montigny
1992 Pontiac Firebird 5.0
Bone Stock Officer, I Swear !
The members of this board are enthusiasts, not experts.
Please consider everything that you read an opinion.
08-09-2002, 07:09 PM
#7
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fuel pump relay could be out. it wouldnt activate the pump until sufficient oil pressure was reached (cranking over). the pump will only work off the oil pressure sensor, it uses the relay for start up.
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1989 350/N20 IROC-Z M6
-T56
-3.42
-Chip
-150 Wet Shot
(273RWHP 361RWTQ)
(314FWHP 415FWTQ) (15% factor)
no drugs on dyno
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1989 350/N20 IROC-Z M6
-T56
-3.42
-Chip
-150 Wet Shot
(273RWHP 361RWTQ)
(314FWHP 415FWTQ) (15% factor)
no drugs on dyno
08-09-2002, 09:15 PM
#9
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1. 90-92 F bodies don't have 9th injector aka. cold start injector AFAIK.
2. O2 sensor has no effect on starting because a. It is cold and needs to be hot to read anything. b. Car starts in open loop which does not read O2 readings but uses program in the EPROM.
Check the fuel filter and fuel pressure. Also see if there is any fuel leakage. Check plugs before starting and see if they are damp
2. O2 sensor has no effect on starting because a. It is cold and needs to be hot to read anything. b. Car starts in open loop which does not read O2 readings but uses program in the EPROM.
Check the fuel filter and fuel pressure. Also see if there is any fuel leakage. Check plugs before starting and see if they are damp
08-09-2002, 09:27 PM
#10
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9th injector? I don't even have a THIRD injector AFAIK LOL it's TBI.
but I will look into the fuel thing.
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James D Montigny
1992 Pontiac Firebird 5.0
Bone Stock Officer, I Swear !
The members of this board are enthusiasts, not experts.
Please consider everything that you read an opinion.
but I will look into the fuel thing.
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by aklim:
1. 90-92 F bodies don't have 9th injector aka. cold start injector AFAIK.
2. O2 sensor has no effect on starting because a. It is cold and needs to be hot to read anything. b. Car starts in open loop which does not read O2 readings but uses program in the EPROM.
Check the fuel filter and fuel pressure. Also see if there is any fuel leakage. Check plugs before starting and see if they are damp</font>
1. 90-92 F bodies don't have 9th injector aka. cold start injector AFAIK.
2. O2 sensor has no effect on starting because a. It is cold and needs to be hot to read anything. b. Car starts in open loop which does not read O2 readings but uses program in the EPROM.
Check the fuel filter and fuel pressure. Also see if there is any fuel leakage. Check plugs before starting and see if they are damp</font>
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James D Montigny
1992 Pontiac Firebird 5.0
Bone Stock Officer, I Swear !
The members of this board are enthusiasts, not experts.
Please consider everything that you read an opinion.
08-09-2002, 10:40 PM
#11
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<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by James Montigny:
9th injector? I don't even have a THIRD injector AFAIK LOL it's TBI.
but I will look into the fuel thing.
</font>
9th injector? I don't even have a THIRD injector AFAIK LOL it's TBI.
but I will look into the fuel thing.
</font>
08-10-2002, 06:40 PM
#12
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Check your fuel pressure before you crank for first time. Watch for length of time it takes to build pressure then start engine. Shut off and then watch the pressure gauge and see how long until fuel pressure drops and by how much. If less than 5 lbs in 5 minutes likely fuel is not the problem.
Thoroughly clean the throttle body as well.
If both are ok, then install a spark check device (goes between plug wire and either spark plug or dist cap) and watch during the cranking cycle. My question to you is does the 92 TBI use a crank sensor as well as the cam sensor in the distributor? If so and no spark is seen during the long crank time then this may be where your trouble lies.
Thoroughly clean the throttle body as well.
If both are ok, then install a spark check device (goes between plug wire and either spark plug or dist cap) and watch during the cranking cycle. My question to you is does the 92 TBI use a crank sensor as well as the cam sensor in the distributor? If so and no spark is seen during the long crank time then this may be where your trouble lies.
08-10-2002, 08:36 PM
#13
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I gave the TB a good cleaning last night, I will do the checks you described and see what happens. I just put a new cap/rotor on there (no help) I dread having to do plugs/wires on this thing 
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James D Montigny
1992 Pontiac Firebird 5.0
Bone Stock Officer, I Swear !
The members of this board are enthusiasts, not experts.
Please consider everything that you read an opinion.
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James D Montigny
1992 Pontiac Firebird 5.0
Bone Stock Officer, I Swear !
The members of this board are enthusiasts, not experts.
Please consider everything that you read an opinion.
08-11-2002, 01:03 PM
#14
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fuel pressure regulator will cause it to take a while to start. i found this out at work last week on working on a caddilac with a TBI 305 in it......after working on it for two weeks looking at everything else.
08-11-2002, 04:32 PM
#15
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Short of replacing it, is there a good way to test this? I think I have my FP gauge laying around, assuming there is a shrader valve on the TBI setup similar to that on my 3.4.
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James D Montigny
1992 Pontiac Firebird 305 TBI
Bone Stock Officer, I Swear !
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James D Montigny
1992 Pontiac Firebird 305 TBI
Bone Stock Officer, I Swear !
The members of this board are enthusiasts, not experts.
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