tubular front
01-29-2003, 11:56 AM
#31
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i was told that the pa unit isn't very strong...........can you give me some advice as to why this may or may not be wrong?
have you ever checked out anthony jones or the many others?
all of the pieces seem to run about the same price, the designs however are all quite different unlike mustang applications where everyone has different products but a similar build?
have you ever checked out anthony jones or the many others?
all of the pieces seem to run about the same price, the designs however are all quite different unlike mustang applications where everyone has different products but a similar build?
01-29-2003, 01:52 PM
#32
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Originally posted by MRZ28HO
Yeah, one. It cost more than using OEM style springs and struts. Springs and Struts cost ~$400, where as the coil overs can cost from (IIRC) $700 up. I am speaking in regards to the whole set, not just the front pair.
Especially if you are converting from OEM. Other than that, there is none, except you are now running on more expensive hardware, but it is better. If money is "no object" (it always is though, hence our questions), then go with the coil over. I wish I could have done it back then.
Who told you that, or how did you come to that conclusion?
The OEM setup WAS designed to hold all that load, hence why after over 20 years it is still supporting it. The STB will not "help support the weight", that is not the design intent of a Strut Brace. It is designed as a BRACE against axial loads parallel to the front axle. This load causes the strut towers to come closer to one another, there by deforming you suspension geometry (mainly your camber and caster). The strut brace helps prevent that, not "help support the weight." 
Yeah, one. It cost more than using OEM style springs and struts. Springs and Struts cost ~$400, where as the coil overs can cost from (IIRC) $700 up. I am speaking in regards to the whole set, not just the front pair.
Especially if you are converting from OEM. Other than that, there is none, except you are now running on more expensive hardware, but it is better. If money is "no object" (it always is though, hence our questions), then go with the coil over. I wish I could have done it back then.Who told you that, or how did you come to that conclusion?
The OEM setup WAS designed to hold all that load, hence why after over 20 years it is still supporting it. The STB will not "help support the weight", that is not the design intent of a Strut Brace. It is designed as a BRACE against axial loads parallel to the front axle. This load causes the strut towers to come closer to one another, there by deforming you suspension geometry (mainly your camber and caster). The strut brace helps prevent that, not "help support the weight."
Coilovers mount at the strut mounting location and so does the spring, meaning the entire weight of the nose of the car is no longer on the spring perch where it was design, but now on the strut mount, which who knows how much weight that was made to handle, the only thing it had to support stock was the forces a strut see's, nothing like that of a spring.
And with the load being placed on the strut mount you will see more compression AND tension on the strut mounts, which is why i said a STB would be a good idea, not to support the weight, to control it.
01-29-2003, 05:18 PM
#33
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Location: North Hollywood, Ca
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Originally posted by fyrhwk1
I dont know who told you that the STRUT mount was meant to hole the nose of the car like that, but they're wrong. The spring perch is located at a different place, and since the spring is whats holding the weight of the car THAT is the point that was designed to hold the weight of the car.
Coilovers mount at the strut mounting location and so does the spring, meaning the entire weight of the nose of the car is no longer on the spring perch where it was design, but now on the strut mount, which who knows how much weight that was made to handle, the only thing it had to support stock was the forces a strut see's, nothing like that of a spring.
And with the load being placed on the strut mount you will see more compression AND tension on the strut mounts, which is why i said a STB would be a good idea, not to support the weight, to control it.
I dont know who told you that the STRUT mount was meant to hole the nose of the car like that, but they're wrong. The spring perch is located at a different place, and since the spring is whats holding the weight of the car THAT is the point that was designed to hold the weight of the car.
Coilovers mount at the strut mounting location and so does the spring, meaning the entire weight of the nose of the car is no longer on the spring perch where it was design, but now on the strut mount, which who knows how much weight that was made to handle, the only thing it had to support stock was the forces a strut see's, nothing like that of a spring.
And with the load being placed on the strut mount you will see more compression AND tension on the strut mounts, which is why i said a STB would be a good idea, not to support the weight, to control it.
kandied91z;
I can't say which is better, since I only have experience with PA Racing products.
As for anthony jones ... who the heck is that?
One thing to remember, when comparing mild steel versions, is that with strength comes extra weight. Some of it is not needed, other parts are. I can't comment any further in this direction (which is better), since the OEM one is "the best" (although heaviest) and saying one is better/stronger than another (on the internet) is just opinions. I'd recommend going to either 1/4 track or Road Courses (depending on what you want out of this setup) and talk with the guys running tubular setups. They will have more experience (chances are) with various manufacturers' products, and the longevity/durability.
01-29-2003, 06:58 PM
#34
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You do know the OEM K-Member holds the front springs right? Take a look at it next time you change your tires, brakes or anything in that area, it has an upper spring perch. The strut support does not hold the spring at all, only the strut assembly! Look at it!
01-29-2003, 07:15 PM
#35
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alright guys....you both make interesting points.
anthony jones is another suspension choice. they make really nice 4thgen versions....however, because so very few people do this sort of thing to a 3rdgen it's like going in blind.
anyone know if bmr really makes a kit for our cars....and if they do isn't it only a coil over setup?
anthony jones is another suspension choice. they make really nice 4thgen versions....however, because so very few people do this sort of thing to a 3rdgen it's like going in blind.
anyone know if bmr really makes a kit for our cars....and if they do isn't it only a coil over setup?
01-29-2003, 07:34 PM
#36
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Location: North Hollywood, Ca
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Originally posted by fyrhwk1
thats exactly what I'm saying, a coilover places the weight of the car on that strut mount because it moves the spring there, instead of the original place on the K member and subframe, which is what my problem with coilovers is, the strut mount isnt made to hold that weight like a 4th gen is.
thats exactly what I'm saying, a coilover places the weight of the car on that strut mount because it moves the spring there, instead of the original place on the K member and subframe, which is what my problem with coilovers is, the strut mount isnt made to hold that weight like a 4th gen is.
"Ah, I see" said the deaf man.
I understood it as if the OEM setup was not a good design, not that the coil-over (mounting to the strut support only) was a weak design (I agree), sorry. 
kandied91z,
I thought BMR did, but I checked their site ... only LT1/LS1 and (can you believe) 4th gen V6.
I thought there were 3 vendors that made K-Members for our cars (can't think of the 3rd)?
01-29-2003, 08:01 PM
#37
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only 2 that i know of, and nothing coming from steve spohn either 
I wish he'd come up with a design that worked with both, although word is that Road Tech might be making one that'll accept strut/spring instead of coilovers, which would be badass since theirs is the best on the market right now.
No word yet on how hard it is to brace the PA member, but the design really doesn't give me much confidence in its road abilities, although it is designed for the strip.
I wish he'd come up with a design that worked with both, although word is that Road Tech might be making one that'll accept strut/spring instead of coilovers, which would be badass since theirs is the best on the market right now. No word yet on how hard it is to brace the PA member, but the design really doesn't give me much confidence in its road abilities, although it is designed for the strip.
01-29-2003, 09:08 PM
#38
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first of all why on earth would you pay 1,000 for a new k member setup only to have to modify it?
secondly........why would you go through the trouble only to use the stock spring and strut formation? your just loosing extra space for very little weight savings.
not arguing....just questioning?
secondly........why would you go through the trouble only to use the stock spring and strut formation? your just loosing extra space for very little weight savings.
not arguing....just questioning?
01-29-2003, 11:50 PM
#39
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Originally posted by kandied91z
first of all why on earth would you pay 1,000 for a new k member setup only to have to modify it?
secondly........why would you go through the trouble only to use the stock spring and strut formation? your just loosing extra space for very little weight savings.
not arguing....just questioning?
first of all why on earth would you pay 1,000 for a new k member setup only to have to modify it?
secondly........why would you go through the trouble only to use the stock spring and strut formation? your just loosing extra space for very little weight savings.
not arguing....just questioning?
01-30-2003, 01:52 AM
#40
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ok.....what strut mount would? if that's the only problem how would you find or choose one that could support it?
i know very few companies make aftermarket caster/camber plates.....do you know of one that will work?
i know very few companies make aftermarket caster/camber plates.....do you know of one that will work?
01-30-2003, 02:40 AM
#41
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Originally posted by kandied91z
ok.....what strut mount would? if that's the only problem how would you find or choose one that could support it?
i know very few companies make aftermarket caster/camber plates.....do you know of one that will work?
ok.....what strut mount would? if that's the only problem how would you find or choose one that could support it?
i know very few companies make aftermarket caster/camber plates.....do you know of one that will work?
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