JakeRobb

That's right, I remember reading that now, thanks.

When I read that, I asked a question and I don't remember a response. GM is getting 10-15% improvements with DI. So now I can't help but wonder which of the following is true:

1. GM is behind the curve on port-injection engines
2. Ford is behind the curve on direct-injection engines.

Now that we've seen Ford's 3.7L non-DI V6 basically matching GM's 3.6L DI for power and economy, I think we might have an answer (#1), but I can't be sure as there are about a million other variables involved.

bossco

I think that would be hard for SVT to walk away from, one of the more attractive features of the past few SVT cars/trucks are the S/C engines and how easy it is to make big power with them. I can see Ford using the 5.0 across the board, but still supercharging the top model.

A naturally aspirated SVT car would have to really knock some socks off to make up for a very defining feature of the line.

bossco

Ford had some pretty tight cost targets to meet with the 5.0 so I dont think its nessecarily a case of GM falling behind on port injection. Rather GM is ultimately putting all thier eggs in the DI basket where the 5.0 guys had to figure out a way of getting 9/10ths the performance of DI at 5/10ths the price. Once they get their ROI on the 5.0, Ford will probably implement DI.

Z28x

GM should make Ford chase them for a change, How about making that Twin Turbo 3.6L Camaro.

extreme79z

Maybe SVT will try out a big bore 5.0 with f/i? I'd like to see a 5.8 or so s/c motor...

With all this new technology do you think that there is a "new" big block on the horizon? Or do you think they will keep squeezing on these smaller displacement engines.

I mean, I know that Chevy has the 7.0 and all... But is it unreasonable to think that Chevy or Ford could produce an economical big block? Just curious.

Sax1031

I wish SVT would go the 6.2 route.

I think it was Roush that took Ford's SOHC 6.2 and punched it out to 7 liters and made over 800hp na.

But I bet it will still be a s/c engine if/when the SHELBY name goes away.

Z28x

No, supercharged and turbo small blocks is the way they will go. Dodge does have a 6.4L Hemi coming out though.

Z28Wilson

Well, GM's small block displacements have been increasing with each generation, the 5.7 LS1 to the 6.0 LS2 to the 6.2 LS3. This was being done mainly for emissions reasons along with increased power IIRC. Rumor is displacements will start shrinking again as the new technologies are phased in. Fact is we're already seeing "big block" power levels out of these small blocks with superior mileage so there's really no need to develop new big blocks for passenger cars.

STOCK1SC

I think if the 6.4 Hemi comes out it will be the last of the big cube engines. Technology basically makes big cubes obsolete when you can get the same power and torque from a smaller engine with better fuel mileage. If only i could get my hands on a DI 6.4 Hemi in an SRT8 Jeep AWD, that would be a potent combinaton!

notgetleft

How so? I've been pricing mustangs on the ford website, and the CS package is just a bunch of appearance stuff. Maybe "a bunch" is understating it, there are a lot of specific items, iirc: seats, dash, front fascia/grille, rear trim panel, wheels, side stripes, maybe spoiler.

Funny thing is, while i like the CS front fasica and grille, the side stripes look like complete hell, and are only decals to boot. I'd rather just have 5.0 badges and call it a day.

jg95z28

I'm not sure you can equally compare the Boss Mustangs with the Z/28 Camaros. While the Boss 302 was also developed for Trans-Am like the Z/28, Ford also created the Boss 429, essentially taking it to the next level, which is something GM never did with the Z/28 as they used the SS and COPO to achieve that. Additionally, while the Z/28 was purely an in-house project, Ford hired Kar Kraft to build the original Bosses for them. By the time 1970 rolled around, the differences between the SS and Z/28 had become relatively blurred, especially with the availability of an automatic in the Z/28. It seems that GM moved to making the Z/28 more of a street car, whereas Ford essentially killed off the Boss after the 351C version as to not bastardize it with a lot of fluff.

It'll be interesting to see which direction each goes with their modern interpretations, however seeing as what the Z/28 eventually became, at least for me it would be less sacrilegious for the car we've been hearing will get the Z/28 badge, than if Ford went a similar route with the modern Boss. However it sounds like Ford plans to stay close to the original formula. At least I hope it doesn't turn into a "badge" car.

super83Z

Both.

The Boss is just going to be suspension parts and a tune away from the GT, Uunless they go the 450hp+ route. I think the Camaro's answer to that should just be a package as an option on the SS. A handling package with better suspension tuning and a "freer exhaust" or something. I don't care what went head to head in the 60's, everything has changed since then.

As was mentioned by someone else the Boss was alot more in the 60's too, now its minor mods and probably mostly decals. I am sure everyone will know your driving a Boss Mustang.

I know what you think should go head to head with the Boss but with this Gen Camaro in mind, what do you think should be built to go head to head with the current GT500? Motor, trans, HP ratings etc. We'll call it the ZL1 for fun.

Z284ever

Here's my lament. The Boss sounds like exactly the kind of pony car I'd like. Hotter but normally aspirated V8. Suspension tuned for best handling. Stickiest rubber. Most agressive brakes. Weight reduction through both lightening and content limiting. A package that is not necessarily for everyone - but is EXACTLY what some want. All wrapped in a legendary name. It's like I wrote the effing script and Ford is acting it out.

I want a Camaro like that. The problem here is, that this Camaro is a different kind of car. It cannot compete directly with this formula - not in a way which would make it superior to or even have parity with the Boss Mustang. I know that. You know that. We all know that. And that's what upsets me.

My hope is that the Boss Mustang make one HUGE splash when it's released. So huge in fact, that GM decides it must respond in kind. Too late for the 5th gen - but maybe with the 6th gen.

jg95z28

But is Ford going to build enough for it to make any splash other than for diehard Ford enthusiasts and collectors? I haven't read any projected production numbers, but I was under the impression that they would be sold in limited numbers at a premium price.

Furthermore, I don't believe it is "too late" for the 5th gen. GM could easily start with a 1SS, dumb down the content add better brakes and suspension, a mix of carbon fiber and plastic panels, replace the LS3 with an LS7 and have one pretty flippin' sweet answer for the competition. And I don't disagree with you that such a vehicle would be more appropriate for the Z/28 name. Just call the LSA Camaro "SS Supercharged" instead.

Bob Cosby

I have my doubts that the Boss will be significantly lighter (perhaps not even measurably lighter) than a standard, low/no option GT. Hope I'm wrong.

At $39k, I have no doubt it will appeal to enough to buy them all up, but probably not to me.