Wow, I'd LOVE to hear the reviews on an overhauled GTO-based Camaro..............
(go read around to find out why the concept-car only showed it face in 2006.)


Actually...it's been out for two and a half years (barely), and come production time, the project will have had 2.2 years in the oven.

 

 

Actually its closer to 3 years...and they started showing it at shows around 2 1/2 years ago they They had the idea before the pictures leaked(I guess)hopefully it has a longer run than cavalier gxp, my bad the GTO. Styling doomed the car before it got out of the gate. YOU know you hate that it is taking and has taken gm this long....

 

Of course I do. We all do! But I can understand why it's taking them this 'long'.
I for one, don't want a slapped-together Challenger. oops, did I say that out loud?


Anyways, Stock...and rocks.

 

Well, I appreciate the clarification. The Malibu is new, but the undepinnings have a bit more history than 2008. The Ecotec isn't a new untested piece either. It's more than good looks that's geting the Malibu noticed.

I realize the Camaro has been out of production longer than fans of the car would like.

As for Saleen being able to do in short time... He built a movie car. A good looking piece that generated a lot of recognition. Still, it's a movie car and it's only suitable for that purpose. The production Camaro is quite a bit further reaching and more desirable than a reskinned Monaro.

It's unfortunate that you think GM is "messing up this car". I gotta disagree completely with your conclusion.

 

I don't think GM is in panic. They have quite a bit going on in alternative fuels and fuel saving tech.

 

I didn't say they were.............. I said they sounded like it.

Read all of the topics on what has been said to the media lately, and it truly does come off like they really don't know what to do. Of course, their manage by commitee method can easily cause that................ and goodness knows that fast and decisive decisions are not something that GM is known for.

I realize I will probably get slammed for saying this, but you all know that it is true. Frankly, the amount of justification that has been going on around this site is starting to sound like there is a need for a 12-step program. Talk about codependency. LOL

I watch all of this with amazement actually. When the bad news just keeps coming in, then everyone is in uproar, and they want things to change now. Then, if a day goes by without much bad news, everyone starts justifying everything that GM is doing, or not doing................. and by the end of the day, there are just a few of us that are truly worried. Its kind of like watching my mother with her string of loser boyfriends.

 

Well, as for me? I'm optimistic.

I agree that there are mood swings here, but that's nothing at all new.

A great new Camaro is coming and I think folk will spend their money well if they are in a position to buy one.

The things which concern me are political and economic. The price of gas doesn't bother me as much as folks running for office proud to suggest they will raise taxes. Ask Herbert Hoover how well that worked in an inflation/recessionary cycle.

Like I said, I'm optimistic. I'm seriously thinking of buying a new Chevrolet for my wife on Monday. I figure it's cloudy but the sky isn't falling.

 

You know, we all stay very optimistic about GM's future and I think in this day of extreme speculation it has actually had an impact on the stock. Even though I'm sure no one will believe it.
I don't think some guy on the internet is going to know Toyota's business model.

I hear this a lot, but I disagree. Chrysler has thrown some good hail-marys in their day.



Im gonna start a new thread for this.

 

No one is going to bail out GM after the mistake Cerberus made trying to take on Chrysler. Sounds like they're a few weeks from chapter 11.

One problem facing GM is definitely the dealer mark up, and has been for a long time. It just hasn't been critical until now.

I don't think their biggest problem can be fixed a reasonable amount of time. They build great trucks, but their cars are $h!t. I drove a new Impala recently and wouldn't give it to my son as a starter car. Interior by Playskool, strut clunk, uncomfortable, gutless pile of dog$hit. No thanks, after driving my company car Camry for a year, I'm going with Toyota for my family's vehicles.

They need to dump the entire truck line with the exception of basic 1/2 and 1 ton work trucks and start making cars not as good as, but BETTER than Toyota, Honda, and Nissan. If they aren't, they WILL go out of business. With a market cap of less than $7B in an overall market of trillions, does it really matter though?

The future is electric. They better be working overtime on releasing a high quality version of the Volt ASAP if they expect to survive.

 

Like a rock
Stock was low as it could be
Like a rock
no one buyin SUV's
Like a rock
oooooh Like a rock.

couldn't help myself

 

^^

 

Unfortunately, I'm not cluey enough to understand the accounting lingo as my understanding of a loss is losing money or assets.

GM have been making losses for years, the manufacturing volume hasn't really increased over the years and GM are losing market share at a rapid rate. And GM has been hampered by the fact that it's been unable to shrink it's workforce in line with the drop in market share. All these factors have led to financial firms downgrading stock to virtually junk levels.

Not being an accountant, I don't understand how there are any positives when the situation is bad and outlook bleak... Despite all this, GM seems happy with its current position, going forward?

So my short question is what real alternatives do GM have short of declaring Ch11? And I don't mean how can GM sell assets in order to secure money and/or loans, I mean how can GM turn the business around?

 

Yea that they should be putting out in commercials..Hondas doing it witht he Clarity vehicle..while GM has been doing the same for YEARS

 

Believe me, GM has some big challenges ahead and I not that big a cheerleader. But I do not believe the situation is as dire as immediate bankruptcy like some. The big challenge for GM remains cash flow. They burned through $3.6B in net cash flow from operations (after capital investments) in Q108. That is really bad and lots of people are extrapolating a continuation of those kind of numbers. The issue is they actually used up $2.1B of working capital in the quarter due to getting caught short on the demand picture deterioration and American Axle strike.

This kind of working capital burn should not happen again (and has not happened in the previous three years) and in fact should reverse as they adjust the inventory to new demand levels. So you can think about GM in Q1 as losing about $1.5B in cash from other than working capital, $2.0B from working capital, and doing this while only making 885K units in North America. Q208 will be more of the same, they are only making 835K units in NA - but an incremental 60K for Rest of World (ROW). So, it would not be a surprise to see another big burn for Q2. An optomist would say they reverse the working capital issue and get flat cash flow even with the lower volume numbers. I am not quite that big an optomist.

One other thing to mention is in the first half, GM will have reduced US inventory at dealers by close to 130K units (probably $3B in revenue). I would not expect this level of adjustment going forward either.

Finally, to the more positive view. GM production for Q3 looks to be increasing about 125K units (200K units above Q307) and Q4 looks to be an all-time high unit build number. It is not North America driving the numbers, it is international. International automotive revenue has been up $8B, $9B, and $14B the last three years. In Q108, it was up $3.5B so it continues to improve.

Couple this with the upcoming savings from implementation of the UAW contract and by 1/1/2010 GM will be looking at $6B in costs coming out of the North American model. What do the true worldcars save in mfg and material costs? Who knows, but given this is their biggest cost bucket it is probably significant as well. Traverse, Camaro, Volt, and new small cars add to momentum in 2010.

By the way, GM has $23.1B in cash right now. Compare that to a low of $16.6B at the end of 2005. There is some good news around, it is just a little hard to keep track of with the full-size market imploding. Get the labor agreement implemented, hit the Volt dates, get the worldcars and better mileage vehicles into production, continue to drive international business, and conserve cash as best as possible. You add all that up and GM would be in a position to have $5-$6B annual cash flow by 2010.

Also, the US pension plan has $104B of assets with only $85B projected liability. They are currently $19B overfunded. It is near impossible to get this money back out of the pension and to the company, but not totally impossible. If GM really believed the turnaround story, I would have the pension buy up 25% of the outstanding stock (only $1.7B). At $11.55, it would not take much to show quite a return. It is amazing they only have a $6.5B market valuation - but most people are looking for the black lining.

On the other hand - they have $40B in debt, are having to put up huge promotions to move cars in NA, GMAC auto loans may join Rescap in falling apart, and are counting on unproven technology to get the Volt into production, while currently lagging behind on small car offerings. What to believe?