Aneurysm

To me, 98+ seems like a big difference, I mean the entire front end is different! I agree that's about all that's different, but aren't there some interior differences as well? and I think the spoiler on the 98+ is different as well. all in all, I would probably consider the LS1 a generation ahead of the LT1, because it WAS redesigned.

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2001 Camaro SS #C095 RCS Secret Street #R675
Light Pewter Metallic
M6, T-Tops, Ebony Leather
Appearance: Alpena Pedals, 15% Tint (Side & Rear), SLP Car Cover.

guionM

LS1 was the bases of a new generation of V8s, aimed at replacing the Vortec of the day. The LS1 itself was pushed hard to be ready for the Corvette. The new front end on the Camaro was necessary because the LS1 & it's intake wouldn't fit under the existing Camaro's hood. The B-bodies (including the Impala SS) had it's engineering and testing done for the LS1 before GM pulled the plug on those cars.

As far as the other changes in Camaro, the new interior, dash, and tail lights came out in 1997. The noseclip, front suspension changes and the LS1 came out in 1998.

I don't really get how you see the LS1 as a 5th gen being that it's a 4th generation V8 engine that has nothing to do with a car model.

BlkDth

Look at how much the second gen changed from beginning(chrome split bumpers & open grille) to the end with a completely different front facia(plastic & rubber moldings). They also had a few eng & inter. changes.

With that said I don't think the 4th gen. 97 style to 98 style is enough to call it a knew gen.

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Stock 96Z28 all opt. ex.t-tops

Aneurysm

Well it wasn't just the noseclip, the front fenders and hood are different as well. Alos as you say, the suspension is different. I dunno, to me it seems like half the car changed over 97/98.

Z28x

The V6 Camaro kept the same engine, interior body, rims, tail lights, trans, etc... all it got was new head lights front bumper cover and hood, that doesn't make it a new gen. of car. if that was the case the WS6 would be a generation past the regular Firebird formula. The WS6 has a different front bumper cover, hood, fog lights, rims, exhust, rear bumper cover, spoiler.

jrp4uc

As pointed out, the changes were made to accomodate the LS1: It's called refreshening. Think how the C4 Corvette changed from '84 to '96. It wasn't the C5 when it was refreshened for the '91 ZR1/'92 LT1. I don't even think the more drastic appearance changes for the '99 Mustang constituted a separate generation from the '94-'98.

It's all too bad, too. If the '98 Fbody had received MORE of a refreshening across the board, we may still have the cars today.

guionM

The noseclip is the entire nose of the car forward of the doors & windshield (hood, fenders, bumpers, lights, etc..).

Perhaps half of the car was changed somewhat, but it wasn't enough for me to buy a 2002 .

In retrospect, I think the 97/98 changes were too conservative & therfore quick to age. Pontiac's TransAm concept recently posted here was in my view absolutely fantastic. Also it seemed alot of people here liked Chevy's Z28 Concept (though it didn't do anything for me.).

I feel the 4th gen layout had more life in it. If alot more leeway was given to reskin the F-bodies (I suspect it wouldn't cost too much since the only exterior sheetmetal was the rear fenders & hood) some visually exciting packages (ie: Bullit, Mach1, or at least the forementioned TransAm concept w/ that shaker hoodscoop), it would likely be enough to get current 4th gen owners (and alot of Mustang owners as well) to spring for a new .

But the idea is moot now, isn't it?

redzed

I think you're more perceptive than some of the "experts" will give you credit for. The 1998 model year wasn't a "redesign" in the strictest sense of the word, but the mechanical and cosmetic changes were pretty significant.

Sure, the tail lights were changed the year before, but that was because the Camaro was replacing the Trans Am for export to Europe. The same goes for the redesigned dashboard.

Taking into a account the world-beating LS-1 and the excellent headlamps - the old sealed beam units were a little dim - the 1998 redesign gave the 4th generation a second wind. Perhaps Chevrolet should have promoted it as a "total redesign." As later events proved, modesty doesn't sell cars. In truth, 1998 was just as significant for the Camaro, if not more so, as 1999 was for the Mustang.

On the other hand, I never felt that mechanically identicle Pontiacs fared as well. After 1998, the only Firebird I ever liked was the Firehawk - I almost bought one off a dealer's lot. (It was a pity that GM didn't pay homage to the understated Trans Am GTA of the mid-to-late 1980s. To me, Recaro buckets and BBS rims are always in good taste.)

Z284ever

I think I'm one of the few who liked the TransAm concept (except for the shiny wheels) also.I especially liked the shaker hood on the Trans Am concept . Talk about a classic Trans Am cue!!!

Regarding the Z/28 (Chevy even used the SLASH on this one) concept, I liked it more for the homage it payed to Camaro's racing heritage than for it's actual looks.

After enduring more than a half decade of Chevy's misguided attempts to convince us that the Z/28 was of little significance to Camaro's heritage...it was refreshing to see some Z/28 enthusiasts within Chevrolet!


.....THE LEGEND LIVES!!!!



[This message has been edited by Z284ever (edited September 09, 2002).]

ReznorZ28

I see what your saying but no. I mean if that was the case, then the 91-92 camaro's would be considered somewhat of a 4th gen model... since it was also redesigned, with new ground effects, hood blisters, and a new spoiler... and I think there were a few minor changes to the interior and a beefed up 350... I guess that would make the LS1 the 6th gen



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My 2 Babies:
94 black Z28-5.7 k&n cold air induction, performance MAF,air foil & flowmaster exhast. new pics w/ SS hood & spoiler. Custom hvac&light covers and custom storage bin covers for sale
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86 laser red IrocZ - k&n air filters,full msd setup, flowmasters, modifed MAS & air foil,92 hood, Ground Effects & spoiler
86 Z28

Z284ever

Just for fun, let's take this line of reasoning alittle further.

Can't we say that the '69 Camaro's extensive sheetmetal changes really make it a 2nd gen.

...and the '70 was really a 3rd gen...

...and the new bumpers/fascias of the '74 and new rear window of the'75 aren't good for at least one generation change...4th gen.


What about the changes to the '78-'81s...and in '80 Z/28 got real functional "air induction"....5th gen.

The '82s were soooo different than the '81s..that has to be worth a two generation jump....7th gen.

...I mean...shouldn't this really be the 10th gen forum?

RiceEating5.0

Just look at the 94-current mustangs. They're still classified as "sn95's" or the same gen. The body was completly changed, the engines and trannies have seen atleast 2 changes or revisions(3 on the Gt, and 4 on the cobra), plus the aditions of various standard/optional equipment, and other improvements and changes. Despite all that, they are grouped as "sn95's" and are considered to be the same gen.

guionM