96 WS6

Anybody ever make a DIY alcy system? I want to do this for my car but I want to know exactly whats involved. I've been reading on turbobuick.com to find out a little more. This website, http://www.alkycontrol.com/, sells just the alky controllers. So after that all I would need is the pump, reservoir (windshield washer fluid), nozzles and all the little knick knacks correct?

Will this idea work or am I getting ahead of myself. It sounds nice to get cold air for cheap Anybody who has done a DIY alcy kit or an alcy kit in general chime in please.

JordonMusser

fyi, I have a nozzle, pump, and a converted washer resevior if you are interested.

$75 shipped.

Julio

Here here..

Wow I had forgotten my roots on this board..

Guy's need help with the injection process..hollar

Overflow to use is the biggest one you can find. Why so that your not having to conatantly refill it. Pump to use id the Shureflow 2687 from Northern.com 60 bucks..last pump you will ever buy..10 dollars more you get a warranty for an extra year..what a bargain. Nozzles are the McMaster Carr M10 and M15's depending how much volume you need. With a good controller, use the M15's.

Off course braided hoses and flare fittings wherever possible..and an inline filter S2.00 from your favaorite autoparts..must be plastic...not metal.

Hows that for starters..

96 WS6

Thanks for responding Julio! I actually saw some of your posts on the turbo buick board and I peeped your alkycontrol website, looks very nice. I was thinking of going with the TPS voltage controller... That would be nice. I was originally just going to hook the alky system up off a WOT switch as Jordon Musser suggested to me. But I will definitely be investing a controller especially when I up the boost level.

I am going to be using a dual nozzle setup. My boost will most likely not go past 15# in the future. I was thinking that two McMaster M10's would do good right?

Thanks again for the insight into alcy systems julio!

EDIT: Where can I find those McMaster nozzles? thanks!

Julio

Single nozzle M15 is the way to go. You can always add another nozzle, but truly, unless your cars is in the 10's..a single will do. The trick is to run a pump that can deliver the pressure. See an M15 nozzle with 125 PSI on it will be a huge amount of alcohol..you would not believe what you see if you try this experiment.

The Shureflow pump is factory set at 65 PSI approx, it has an allen screw on the top that lets you increase pressure to your hearts content..mind you too much alcohol will drown the motor and cuase you to lose power..you just need enough to get the job done.

I would run the system of the the MAF signal or a MAP sensor. TPS is not a good idea..you need alcohol with load not rpm or throttle position.

Nozzles are available from myself or mcmastercarr.com. I sell the nozzle,elbow and sealing washer for 10.00 plus shipping..

I have twin 10's on my car. If I had to do it over, would of used a single 15. A lot of times...less is more

HTH

96 WS6

Julio, thanks again for responding. The only reason why I wanted to run a dual nozzle setup was (if you saw my previous post) because my intake elbow has a divider separating into two different sections. Since I can't put the nozzles before the MAF my only choice is to have it on the intake elbow. How would I be able to get proper alcohol distribution with the nozzle on only one side of the intake elbow. That's why I wanted two nozzles.

If you have a way around that please let me know because I will do it that way. I ordered the alcohol kit from Jordon Musser, a pretty highly respected member of this board. I will find out the exact specs on the pump and nozzle and see what I'm working with. I will probably end up getting a new nozzle from you but we'll see. Also, where can I get steel braided line for the alcohol for the McMaster nozzles???

I have so many question it's not even funny. Is there a number I can reach you at, I presume the number on your website won't be answered on weekends... Anyways, let me know so I can answer all my questions and get a proper alky kit together =)

Julio

I see this kind of stuff on cars that have dual throttle bodies.

If you can get the nozzle rite before it splits, it will work. The air getting pushed through the pipe will distribute it. Alcohol doenst work like an injector whereas you need a precise amount per cylinder. Not that it cant hurt, but typically no.

Wait till you get the kit..see what you have..take it from there.

Dont fret over the little stuff.

727-526-9724 shop

Leave a message if i'm not there,

Julio

96 WS6

Thanks man... what do you mean by dual throttle bodies??? The LT1 has a twin throttle body if that's what you mean... I swear I knew when I was cutting the elbow not to cut that far but I had not choice for my blow through MAF... Unless I put the nozzle through the end of the MAF after the resistors there is no way for a single nozzle to cover it...

What makes a dual nozzle setup harder to work with? I thought I could just split the line coming from the pump into two nozzles. If I remember my physics correctly, when you double the surface area of the nozzle aren't you also cutting the pressure in half??? Or am I just saying some dumb ****??

Julio

What I meant by dual throttle bodies was a car like a twin turbo Supra.

Isnt the plenum a common area after the throttle body. What I mean is that after the air goes past the throttle body the intake in essence is open? Now if your intake is also completely divided as in the case of a Supra, then you dont have a choice. But just becuase you have two butterflies doesnt mean you have to have two nozzles. The alky when misted finds itself into the cylinders..Like fuel coming out of a carburator finds itself into a cylinder.

Listen the additional expense of running a second nozzle is about 50 dollars. For the "Y", the nozzle, and the braided line. I'm just giving you feedback as to its relative necessity

On a turbo Buick the nozzle is a good 6-12 inches before the throttle body. If it makes you feel better about it, then yes add the second nozzle.. I'm just giving you feedback that its more than likely not going to influence any distribution benefit.

On that note, I wouldnt put the nozzle close to the MAF but closer to the TB. I dont think that misting the MAF directly would be good. I dont think it can hurt, but no reason if avoidable.

rskrause

It's only common sense to try to get the distribution reasonably even. You can have too much water/alco, which kills power and you can have too little, which prevents you from getting maximum benefit.

Rich Krause

96 WS6

I'd like to run one nozzle but I have nowhere to put it... If I injected the alcohol on one side of the intake elbow would it mess up distribution? I mean it's not like it's divided by passenger and driver's sides, it is top and bottom. I think one nozzle may just work out okay. If I spray only on the top of the intake elbow would the alcohol stream be messed up???

BlackDog

Can anyone help me understand the benefits and the workings of this system? Does it give you more power and help control detenation? I've been to the website but, still don't understand.
I'm very interested in this setup.

Scott

Julio

I can only add that when alcohol leaves a nozzle it does so in the form of a mist not stream. The nozzles I use are known as mist nozzles. No one knows the intake tract on your car better than yourself. I only go the extra steps in order to try and save you time and money. Running the second nozzle only involves a number 4 "Y" from NOS, and extra nozzle and the line between the two. No biggie..just going extra steps before I personally say it is needed. Thats why ..

Can it hurt, no. its just a little more $$ for piece of mind.

Most of the time the nozzes are placed where they fire at each other..The spray pattern kinda looks like those water sprayers they have on fans at football stadiums.. non directional. Like fog..

The air leaving the SC forces this mist into the intake whereas it enters the chamber and does its majic. Hope this makes sense.

Remember we are not squirting alcohol..we're misting it at high volumes How much depends on a lot of variables..

Julio

Scott,
There is a lot to this, but it is pretty simple. Very easy to over engineer..and once you try and see the results, you wont take the kit off. Now as far as background..

In laymans terms, it all started with water injection maybe 60 years ago during WWII on planes..many companies sell different variations of the same thing. Purpose is to add an agent that suppresses detonation into the combustion chamber. Water for instance is unlimited octane and lots use it to gain a little edge. But there comes a time that too much water becomes harmful..hence the addition of alcohol to help it burn. Now into the current playing with this stuff.. I find that running higher amounts of alcohol yields results that are beneficial two fold. One is that alcohol has tremendous cooling properties..Pour some isopropyl on your hands..and add the fact it has higher octane so it burns clean. Wont harm O2's or any other equipement. Has zero consequences to any internal engine parts..To this I have witnessed many motors that have come apart after thousands of miles of abuse with zero indications of anything. Only note is that these motors were running straight alcohol for injection with no water. dont know if there would be any consequences with the use of water.

How much water is a huge debate among all groups. But the range in consensus is between 50/50 and 100 percent alcohol. Which type of alcohol is another debate. That consensus is between denatured and methanol. Iso in 3rd.

If your engine is running knock free at the current level it isnt needed. If your goals are to increase power where higher octane will be required, then this is the E ticket.

My car has been on a steady alcohol diet since Sept 2001. Probably have had at least 500 passes at the track, countless on the roads, and to this date never have had the engine opened for any reason. It has seen no less than 22 PSI for this amount of time on a motor where 16 would be the maximum safe level. Currently I squeeze 26 through it on straight 93.

The idea of the progressive is something new. A couple companies make them. I took it to a different level with the flexibility offered. On a turbo car its a dream.. becuase as the boost increases so does the amount of "MIST". It saved my own personal motor a month ago when I had a waste gate hose fail and my boost shot to 30 PSI..had the kit not kept adding..I would have had engine damage.

Sorry for the novel, ask.. we have plenty of expertise.

rskrause

Water has a much higher heat of vaporization than alcohol, so it is superior as an injection fluid. As Julio mentioned, there is certainly an upper limit to the amount of water you can inject, hence the common practice of mixing alcohol and water. I use between 1:2-1:1 alcohol to water. Either methanol or ethanol may be used.

Rich Krause