around town? I'm currently on my second LS1 right now and neither car(both stock and w/ bolt-ons) feels real powerful from a dead stop or low speed roll. Whether I dump the clutch from a standstill or do a big downshift, I just don't get pushed back into my seat like a car making as much power as the LS1 does(even when I spin or chirp the tires hard). Don't get me wrong, both of my LS1's have been(and are) definitely FAST, but the car just doesn't feel as fast as it really is on the streets. Now when I go WOT from a 50+ roll, OMG!!! Too bad I can only drive like that on the highway or at the track. Honestly though, my car sure doesn't feel like it is making the 323rwhp & 342rwtq that it has dynoed(SAE corrected) with just a lid & cat-back. He!!, my mom's 2003 high-output Grand Cherokee Jeep(325 lb/ft) feels a lot torquier down-low.

Mike

2002 M6 Z28-(new)
!CAGS, Direct-Flo lid, & GMMG Chambered Exhaust

2000 A4 Z28-(old)
Direct-Flo lid, FTRA, & GMMG Chambered Exhaust

 

I use to think the same thing, i just got use to all that horsepower, then i let my cousin drive my car while i rode passenger and when he punched it, HOLY ****, i pulled my eyesockets out, you just got use to your cars power!!

 

Yep, you're just used to it. Try going from a 30HP Beetle to a 350+ LS1 and you'll feel the difference, trust me!

 

You definitely get used to the power,but the torque peaks at a higher rpm than say an LT1.Thats why you dont feel the off idle low speed punch your talking about.I love my Trans Am but I have always had the same complaint.If you dont already have them put gears in the car.

 

The Tq on a LS1 is very flat and peaks kinda high. its just very decieving.

Dont compare the ls1 to a lt1. they make almost the same tq down low, but the ls1 just makes more higher in the rpm band.

 

Well i have a LT1 and i always heard how much low end grunt these engines were suppose to have and i have to say i am not impressed with mine,i have a buddy with a 88 LX mustang and his car is much more impressive around town driving but when you line the two cars up i have no problem beating him.I think the problem is that the power is so smooth in a LS1 and my LT1(because it is modded to breath better)that you just don't feel the big hit because unlike the 5.0L which starts falling off the LS1 just keeps pulling all the way to redline and never lets up.And i also agree that you are probably just use to it but again it doesn't take long to get use to it because the power is so smooth.

 

You may have just gotten used to it. But... I've also heard that there is a feature programmed into the PCM in all LS1's called torque management. I know the Vette's have it and I've heard that the F-Bods do too. It's to keep you from busting driveline components during shifting as well as for better traction. What it does is limit the amount of torque available immediately after a shift and I think starting out in first too. This is the first thing to take off when reprogramming a PCM. It entirely changes the driving "feel" of the car. I have always noticed that there is an abrupt surge in power, when rolling from a dead stop, as soon I get in the mid-2000 RPM range in my SS.

If anybody knows differently, I welcome your correction. But this is what I have heard on this board as well as others. I have yet to reprogram my PCM so I can't really speak from experience. But it does make sense to me.

 

I did not know about the torque management thing in the pcm.But this goes back to the question Im always asking, wouldnt it have been easier to just put good parts in these cars than putting all these bandaids on the weak parts to survive the power?

 

Repeated and continuous abuse will result in the failure of any part regardless of the quality. It may take some parts longer to fail than others. But If you abuse your driveline continuously, the weakest part will be there to poke it head out sooner or later. And there will always be a weakest link in any chain. I'm not a huge fan of GM's build quality but I feel pretty confident in the quality of the driveline components in my SS.

Now, if I put slicks on the back and drag race it every weekend, I can be pretty sure the 10 bolt is gonna self destruct. This is a fact of life. GM built the cars to be daily drivers. Most aren't driven by speed enthusiasts. So to make race cars out of what GM gave us, we have to make some upgrades. I think that's reasonable.

No?

 

I realise that GM builds cars for daily driving and thats what I do with my Trans Am but, there is something wrong when you have to put torque mangement in the processor,a restrictor in the line between the clutch master and slave cylinder,and a relatively weak clutch in the car when you know some of the driveline pieces are border line for the power a stock LS1 makes.All im asking is why couldnt GM put the 8.5in 10bolt in these cars?Ford builds Mustangs for daily drivers also But they were smart enough to put a good axle in it.Just my opinion.I didnt mean to stray from the topic.

 

1) You get used to the flat tq curve.. so its deceptively smooth.. Passangers on the other hand are bewildered especially if they never sat in a fast car, or people that drive small displacment turbo cars.... the phrases that pop up alot: "this thing doesn't have tq.. it has constant thrust!" or "I expect the acceleration to drop off, but it keeps on pulling pulling and pulling!"

2) 1st gear is way tall from a deadstop goes all the way up to 50 mph! And since the LS1 RELATIVELY has a touch less tq down below than say a LT1, off the line, if you don't do it right you eithe bog or spin.. If we only had the Z06 gearing.....

 

I don't think the F-Body's have the torque management program, if so teh 6 speeds would be way faster.

My avalanche has it for sure. I have 340 horses with 455 pounds of torque. When it shifts into second it pushes you back in your seat. From first it's super slow even with 4:10's. The driveline is so heavy that it sucks 100 horses from the motor but I guess it still needs to limit the fuel going to the motor in 1st. The automatic tranny would be destroyed with out it. Too bad they can't fit the allison under the Burbs/avalanches.

 

As a few others said, I think you're just used to the feel of driving the LS1, and as you punch the gas you subconciously expect the "pin you back" feeling, and don't conciously feel that force.
I know this sounds like a really goofy answer, like I think I'm Sigmen Freud or something, but I have had this same complaint, but came to that conclusion because as I would drive the car around with my girlfriend in the passenger seat I would punch it, and out of the corner of my eye watch her get "pushed back"...so I just assumed that i'm used to the feeling.

 

You guys are right, the LS1 has a very smooth and deceiving feel to it(a la the very flat torque curve it produces). You have no idea your moving as fast as you are. And no doubt I have got used to the power of this engine over the last couple years. But to me personally, this applies to only around town driving(up to the 45mph speed limits). At higher speeds or on the highway, you definitely feel the massive horsepower & torque the LS1 produces(it loves to rev up high)!

As for the LT1, I've heard continuously that it does make more torque down low and hits harder off idle and up to about 2,000rpm or so(remember, its peak torque is 2,400rpm in stock form). And this motor has a rougher feel to it IMHO. Some V8's just transfer the power differently I guess.

It is definitely time for some 4.10 gears(rear-end problems or not).

 

Yep, put those 4.10s in and see just how crazy an LS1 feels then! It's funny because I have a buddy that has a Thunderbird SC with $5K in motor work. He was cruising with me one night when we were rolling with a bunch of Mustangs. We were just tooling around and I wasn't standing on it at all and he mentioned that it didn't seem to pull that hard. A couple of the mustang boys decided to play around on the highway ahead of us and I gave them about 3 car head start before I decided to floor it. I started to reel them in immediately and had to get out of it to avoid running into the back of them. I looked over at my buddy and asked him if he thought it pulled pretty hard then. He just shook his head and said he would never say anything that stupid again. I noticed out of the corner of my eye that he was grabbing for the door handle the moment I jumped on it. He's definitely a believer in the LS1 now. He used to say how he thought he could take me with his super coupe, but after that ride he admitted he didn't have a chance.