Is Amsoil the only group 4 left?

 

http://www.mobil1.com/USA-English/Mo...ynthetics.aspx

Mobil's claim from their own website: Is this no longer accurate??

 

Mobil 1 is now a hydrocraked base with a little added PAO...its no longer PAO only.

 

I never thought Mobil would sellout like that, the whole point of getting mobil used to be that its one of the few true synthetics left on the market. Im assuming german made castrol is still synthetic.

 

====> Sparkz28ss spews <=====

" Mobil 1 is now a hydrocraked base with a little added PAO...its no longer PAO only"

After some spelling lessons prove that statement about Mobil 1. Or are you a dealer for the competition?

I spent 13 years working in the Product Development/Research group that supports Mobil 1. This is the group that travels to the PAO facilities in Beaumont,Texas and Gravenchon, France as part of it's support function.

 

http://www.mobil1.com/USA-English/Mo...Las_Vegas.aspx

see the video. Ive spoken with an engine building in Edmonton, Canada who said the same thing this video shows, that mobil 1 users have clean engine parts when he takes them apart, that was 7 yrs ago though...

There is a text on the bottom of the vid web page which specifies mobil extended performance

 

Sorry about the spelling,but this is not english class,this is the interweb...."spew"?? Dont be an arrogant assclown


"Base oils made by hydrocracking and isomerization technologies had such a signifigant increase in desirable performance over solvent refining technology that in 1993 the API categorized base oils by composition. Solvent refined oils are now referred to as group I base oils. Group II base oils are a vast improvement over group I because they contain lower levels of impurities. Because they are so pure, they have almost no color at all. Improved purity means the base oil and additives can last longer under use. The oil is more inert and forms less oxidation byproducts that can increase viscosity and react with additives.


Group III - Unconventional Base Oils

The API defines the difference between Group II and III base oils only in terms of V.I., viscosity index. Base oils with conventional V.I. (80-119) are Group II and base oils with an "unconventional" V.I. (120+) are Group III. Group III base oils are also called unconventional base oils (UCBO's) or very high V.I. (VHVI) base oils. Group II+ base oils have the same maximum V.I. as Group II (80-119), but have a higher minimum V.I. (110-119).

From a process standpoint, Group III oils are made by the same process as Group II oils, but the V.I. is increased by increasing the temperature of the hydrocracker. The product V.I. can also be increased by increasing the V.I. of the feedstock. Which is done by selecting the appropriate crude.


Group IV - Traditional "Synthetic" Base Oils (PAO)

"The word "synthetic" in the lube industry hase traditionaly been synonymous with PAO, poly-alfa-olefins, which are made from small molocules. The first commercial process for making PAO was pioneered by Gulf Oil in 1951. In the 1960's, Mobil patented an improved process. In the 1970's, Mobil began to market their product as 'Mobil 1'.

Since then, the demand for PAO has grown and some base oil manufactures began using higher V.I. feedstocks to make mineral oils with V.I.'s that matched the PAO's. These new Group III oils were not manufactured from small molecules like traditional synthetics but they bridged the performance gap at a lower cost. Some lubricant manufactures began replacing PAO's with Group III base oils in their "synthetic" engine oils. This created a controversy in the lubricants industry because some believed that PAO's were the only true synthetics.

The National Advertising Department of the Better Business Bureau ruled that Group III base oils can be considered "synthetic" because modern oils made using hydroisomerization technology have most of the same performance features of the early synthetics.
more info...
http://theoildrop.server101.com/foru...t=1&vc=1&nt=14 "

Go shoot some Mobil 1 in a gas chromatograph and tell me how much PAO you see... and then tell me what the base stock is made from.NOT PAO....its group III.I dont care where you have been,or what you have done.Mobil 1 is not PAO based anymore..and no i dont sell oil.Ask me what oil I still pay 8 bucks a Q for and what I still run in my own cars even though I know damn well its not a PAO oil...thats right Mobil 1.

Im not telling people not to use it or by it...Im just telling them what its not...and that is a PAO based oil.Hell if you do work where you say you do,or do what you say you do then you should know how its made...or are you trying to put the cat back in the bag?

 

They're not importing it anymore from what I read.

 

the difference between a PAO base oil and a group III Hydrocracked (highly refined) base oil is virtually nothing. 99.9 something % the same last I read...

but it's ALL MOOT if the additive package sucks. a standard good ole group III oil (non-hydrocracked) with an awesome additive package will out perform/protect vs a perfect PAO base oil with a crappy additive package.

people argue over this 0.1% difference in base oils when the differences in additive packages is what we SHOULD be discussing as that is much more important.

 

====> sparky sputters <====

"Sorry about the spelling,but this is not english class,this is the interweb...."spew"?? Dont be an arrogant assclown"

Arrogance is someone that links to "The OilDrop" (which is sponsored by Castrol) and posits anonymous entries as proof of their claims.

Most of the Mobil 1 passenger car oils ARE GF-4 rated. The ones that don't claim to be GF-4 may be or since they are of a broader vis range the volatility may higher (NOACK test) because of a higher amount of pour-point depressing additives.

I worked in PAO support. Formulation and blending is another location. However I have done some before and after testing of the Mobil 1 I use
in my car and bike. The acid value was unchanged (< 0.1), the 40c and 100c Cannon Autovis values were within 0.1% and the GC showed a "lights" increase from ~0.10% to ~0.15% which was probably from shearing of blending vehicles in the additives package. The C20, C30 and C40 components were unchanged. (6500 car miles, 3500 GSXR-1100 miles)

The base stock for Mobil 1 IS PAO.

 

Please discuss this civilly

 

It was Mobil 1 that took great pains to convince the public that Grade III sucked and PAO base was superior. It was Mobil 1 that tried to convince us that Castrol and other companies that were calling their Grade III's "full synthetics" were making inferior and cheaper oil. After doing all that, they switched to grade III base without telling anybody and continued to charge exorbitant prices while customers WRONGLY assumed they were paying for a grade IV oil!!

Why then, should we now suddenly believe that Grade III oils with proper additives are as good as PAO based "true" synthetics? We were lead to believe that Grade IIIs were more prone to volatility and sludge formation while Grade IVs offered superior protection and extremes of temperature and did not "break down" or change composition over time like the Grade IIIs.

No matter how you look at it, we the public have been lied to. However, the gas chromatograph does not lie!

 

Past tense. How long ago?

 

Jakerobb: I retired 3 years ago but am still in touch with some of the guys.

med_reject: If you think the statements on Mobil's website that lists virtually all of their Mobil 1 passenger car formulations as GF-4 are lies then you should file a class action suit against them.

moderator: I'm just trying to nip this "urban legend" falsehood before it takes root here. If they're not challenged then they continue on forever like the "Accel products are junk" myth and the "the LT1 hotcam and/or LT4 conversion is almost worthless" myth and the "Mobil 1 is OK but it's too thin for it's weight" myth.

 

I don't know what GF-4 means. Nowhere (that I found) on Mobil 1's website says that the oil is all PAOs.