Right now i have an Slp lid, and i was wanderin if i switched to a Whisper Lid, with a k&n filter, if i would gain any hp? thanks...

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2002 navy blues SS slp air box and dual/dual exhaust 345 hp (a4)12 disk cd changer
SLP SS grille 10spoke chrome rims
T-Tops.................

2002 Maroon Chevy Silverado..Mods: K&N Air System, Hypertech power programmer III, and a Throttle Body Bypass.

 

ttt

 

uhh... I do believe the increase would be so minimal it wouldnt even be worth it (1 hp maybe

do you have a K&N in right now? if not, then your biggest gain will be from installing the K&N... about 5hp i think, give or take. but the lid itself, shouldnt really make a difference. I'm pretty sure all the high-performance aftermarket ones are about the same. (Although I have heard more good things about whisper than SLP)



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2001 Camaro SS #C095 RCS Secret Street #R675
Light Pewter Metallic
M6, T-Tops, Ebony Leather
Appearance: Alpena Pedals, 15% Tint (Side & Rear), SLP Car Cover.

 

Actually th lid you have seals alot better than any aftermarket lid. So i would just keep that one instead. If you are going to change anything out, it would be the filter.

 

you will not gain HP using a K&N over a good clean paper filter.

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Rick

'65 Malibu SS - 280rwhp/330ftlbs
'98 Camaro Z28 - 318rwhp/334ftlbs - Sold 7-18-02
'02 TransAm - Brand new No dyno Yet

D-flo lid, GMS, Hotchkis STB, Hurst B+
Bat-CaveOnline

 

If you change your filter, go buy a Holley PowerShot. It's less expensive than the K&N and it fits our cars better.

 

I beg to differ!! Hot Rod did a test on all the aftermarket cloth/oil filters and they all out flowed the paper one they tested it against. Holley made a big 1 hp over the K@N in the test.All 8-10 hp more on a chassis dyno and engine dyno, over the paper.



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Kurt, Sebring Silver mn6 2002 Z28,17"ZR-1 wheels,hurst billet shifterw/ Lou's short stick, clear corners, more to come, as does the cash

 

There is magazine Racing/testing and then there are real world results. After owning 3 4th gens and too many Club dyno days to count, I've seen what makes a difference and what doesn't.

Hot Rod Magazine also wants you to pay 40K for Z28 just because they had Berger Slap on a "special air box", Pulleys, Maf, TT II wheels, Exhaust and stickers.

rick

 

None of this high dollar - low dollar crap matters. It's all about where the rubber meets the dyno. Anyone can whine and cry about an idea being dumb or ridicule people for paying a premium for performance, but the fact remains, real numbers don't lie. " oh they made it colder in the test room, of course the sponsor pays for advertisement" among other things do not change the fact that reputable publications document power gains with a wide variety of products. Sowhat if the idea of paying top dollar for oil/fluids seems ludicrous. If it makes power, the point is moot. That goes for all mods. Thats enough ranting from me.

BadAndy

 

Huh? I didn't say anything about price of the filter or ridicule anyone for using one.

I'm not sure where silver96z28 got the 8-10hp thing anyway.

purolator plus: 246.7rwhp/368.7hp engine dyno.

K&N: 249.7rwhp/368.7 engine.

Holley: 250.6rwhp/367.2 engine.

Also you might want to read the Hot Rod Article mentioned. Here I'll quote the Conculsion notes from that issue.

What this means is the numbers are so close the difference could be due to dyno testing tolerance.

rick

[This message has been edited by Rickm (edited August 15, 2002).]

 

been doing a little research and came across a few interesting things I'd like to share as food for thought. since Air filters are supposed to filter contaminates from entering the engine let's discuss that a little.

let's pretend that a paper filter allows 10,000 gallons of air to enter your engine every hour and there is 10 grams of dirt in the air.

let's say a paper element is 75% efficient at removing particles. then every hour 7.5 grams of dirt particles (75% of 10 grams) would be filtered out and 2.5 grams would enter your engine.

Now, let's assume that these Reusable filter provides 30% greater air flow than the paper filter, but the same filtration efficiency. That means that over the same hour, 13,000 gallons of air would enter the Reusable gauze/oil type filter equipped engine.

that would mean 13 grams of dirt would be within this amount of air. At 75% efficiency (the same as our paper element), over the same one hour time period, 9.75 grams of dirt would be trapped by the filter and 3.25 grams would enter the engine.

So the reusable type filters would have to be 30% better at filtering the air just to keep the same amount of dirt out at the higher the flow rate.

Most Company's don't really specify the Filtration capacity of their air filters (unlike oil filters) but according to SAE J726 air filters should provide dirt protection at a level of at least 96% of particles 10 to 20 microns in size. K&N's site claims they saw some disposable paper air filters with an overall filtration efficiency as low as 93% (way higher than the example above). so based on that, the reusable filters would have to be 123% efficient at filtering the air just to compensate for the increased air flow. (K&N doesn't specify their filters efficiency but they clam they meet the SAE standard of 96%)
I've also seen a few people on LS1.com and few other F-body related BBS doing oil analyses lately. the reusable filter equipped cars show elevated levels of silicon content (i.e sand) in their oil samples. this would back up the theory that these higher flowing reusable filters are flowing more at the cost of filtration for at best a 1-2hp gain over a quality paper filter.


anyway,
rick

[This message has been edited by Rickm (edited August 15, 2002).]

 

Try that again. If the paper filtered 93%, out of 10,000 units of air with 10 dirt particles then 0.7 dirt particles would get though.

Now if the K&N were to flow 13,000 units of air, with the same percentage of dirt you'd have 13 dirt particles. If only 0.7 dirt particles were to get through (to match the paper filters amount of dirt) the filtration percentage would be 94.6 percent, not the 123% concoction you came up with.

93% efficient means 7% dirt gets through, 0.07 * 10 = 0.7
94.6% efficient means 5.4% dirt gets through, 0.054 * 13 = 0.7

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- Steve - 1998 Pontiac Firebird Trans Am
LS1 A4, 2.73's, Kumho Ecsta Supra 712 245/50/ZR16's, Direct Flow Lid, GMAF, !FRA, Loudmouth, 3" Y-Pipe, AIT Mod, Fan Switch Mod
13.774 @ 103.33, 300.5rwhp & 308.6rwtq, 97+ RPO Codes, Join The CamaroZ28.Com Users Webring

 

Two friends of mine ran without air filters with no visible damage to internal engine components. One ran for ~68K miles, and the other for about 12K miles. Now, had they sucked up a small pebble it would have been a diffrent story, but both cars were LT1 Z's and neither suffered any damage what so ever. I don't recommend running filterless, but the fact of the matter is that it is almost harmless. Imagine many years ago how efficient the old filters were. Did you ever hear of anyone having to rebuild their motor because it was too dirty inside..or because it had lost performance from too much dirt.

-Casey

 

Cool my theoretical numbers are off, but what you are really saying is the increased cost of a oil bath type filter is only getting me slightly more filtration than the worst Paper filter K&N claims to have tested and no discernable power increase. (according to the Hot Rod article)

That would mean the value of the increased cost is only coming from the claim that I may not have to service it as often? since it takes more time to clean and oil vs. disposing and replacing does that negate this Value?

and what of the reports of higher silicon content of oil bath filter equipped cars? User Error of cleaning and oiling maybe? The value/justification just keeps going down.
for me anyway, this info may not sway anyone else's decision and that's cool too.

rick

 

Well, Air intake particle damage would only be "visible" in increased oil consumption and/or bearing wear. Yes, People do rebuild engines due to increased wear from poor Air filtration wether they know it or not.

btw, Paper Air filter Technology hasn't changed in Decades.

rick