I would recommend you dont get the FLP's. I know some people really like theirs, but on my friend Aarons car, changing the plugs is a nightmare with them, and he has burned several wires on the #5 primary, even with using heat tape and a shorty plug. They are also much more expensive than the jet-hots. I was also considering switching from mac's to long tubes, but I decided the gains werent worth it, and might go with a small shot of nitrous, or a decent rear-end instead. Good Luck!
Brandon

 

As in the last thread you made this FACTLESS statement in, I have to ask...Where are you getting your information from? On every dyno test I've ever seen that compare the 2, mid lengths make more HP from 3600 RPMs-up! At 5400 RPM, mid lengths made over 20 more HP than longtubes.

Like I said before, I'm glad I "wasted" my money on my MACs...Just to run lousy 12.0's...WITH ALL THE EMISSIONS STILL HOOKED TO THEM!

Frank

 

Well, since most of those who responded to my post (thanks by the way) probably went straight to LT's, without trying the shorties, I'll take your advice since your the first person I know who has experience with both. It's a good thing I didn't order the LT's yet.

Well, now that the LT's aren't on my list of "things to do" anymore, perhaps one of you can reccomend which of the following I shoud go for. These are some of the other parts I wanted to buy.

- HAL "F" series adj. shocks (complete set with front springs) $689

- Power stop slotted rotors (front and back, pads,lines etc.) $549

Maybe there's somthing elso you guys would reccomend? Let me know.

 

I guess you COMPLETELY skipped my post. Let me recap:

There was more power increase in going from Shorty headers to Long tubes in my car than there was going from stock manifolds to shorty headers, 3" high flow cat, and UD pullies at the same time.

Those of you who say LTs make less power than shortys or mid lengths are the ones that dont have the LTs. 12SECZ I usually agree with your posts, but that BS about having 20 more hp over a long tube header is just plan bogus. You had to be looking at two completely different cars, two dynos, or two seperate somethings. No way MAC midlengths are that much better than LTs. If they are so much better, why aren't the fastest cars running them? 12.0 is pretty good, yes, but, I think you could run better ets and mphs with LTs.

 

I'm gonna step out on a limb here and say that maybe its not all that necessary with stock heads to go with long tubes. I think shorties are probably fine in most applications...Frank's car blisters with a set of mid-lengths. A lot also depends on tube size, etc. If I had it to do over again, I'd probably go with a MAC mid-length, and not worry about dragging roadkill on my collectors. Go buy a cam or some headwork instead, and keep your Edelbrocks.

 

It may not be "necessary" but you're still going to make more power with LTs over shortys, bottom line. I'm not saying like 20 rhwp or anything outrageous, but most shorty headers give a gain of 10-15 rwhp, and LTs will give a gain of 20-25 rwhp. So there's your difference.

 

No. I did read it. I read all of the post's on this forum and all other forums I posted this question on. Thing is, I'm getting mixed opinions. That's not surprising. I expected that. What is surprising (and confusing) is that there are people such as your self that claim to have gotton BIG increases in Torque on your LT1's while other's like "Frank95z" claim to have gained little if anything at all. What gives Long Tubes on an LT1 either give you more power than shorties or they dont. How can so many people have so many different results. Long tubes are long tubes. An LT1 is an LT1. I didn't mean any disrespect to you. I did read your post and I appreciate your response . But again, I have to ask: Are Long tubes worth the money over shorties ? How much of an increase (given the mods I've done) should I expect to get ?

Man, I never would have thought making this decision would be so tough. If only I were rich I wouldn't have to worry about anything. I'd just buy the long tubes and if I didn't get any extra HP... oh well. But again, like I said, I'm not rich so I'd like to limit my spending to just getting upgrades worth my money.

 

I already have a cam and my cylinder heads were ported/polished and larger valves were installed (2.02/1.6)

My WEBSITE:

http://members.cardomain.com/lt1fun

Maybe the question I shoud be asking is whether or not I'd see big gains on a cammed LT1 with modded cylinder heads/intake. Well ? Anybody have similar mods, and can tell me if what the LT's were worth over the shorties ?

 

Cammed with heads...I'm gonna say go longtubes...


Just looked at your car...those LT4's just look so purdy

 

I decided to go Midlength's and here are my reasons why. Many of these arguements can be made for you to keep the shorties.

1) I have seen extremely fast times from guys running shorties and midlengths.(low 12's, high 11's) Just because you have shorties or mids doesn't mean you can't run fast. That right there proved that it didn't require LT's to have great times and traps. Many guys that run LT's have fast times, but so do many shorty/mid guys.

2) I didn't want to have the hassle of scraping the LT's, the pain in the butt install, and the custom Y-pipe that typically has to be fabbed.

3) Guys have proven 25-30 HP increases with mids.

4) Less expensive in general than LT's when you consider that mids and shorties come with the Y-pipe

5) You can get emmisions legal shorties if you need to.

This is my theory on why guys feel a big change from shorties to LT's. LT's produce more power lower in the power band where it is used more in daily driving. The power comes on sooner; in the RPM's where you might notice it more. It doesn't mean that they are making that much more HP, but that it comes on sooner so you feel it more often and it feels like there is a lot more HP because of that.

Hope this helps,
Dan

 

Here's a dyno chart reprinted directly out of Car Craft

http://www.geocities.com/max_wylde/dyno.html

Frank

 

You just made me dead set on not giving the LT's a shot. I was very skeptical on trying them with my 224/230 combo, but my mechanic said he'd prefer I'd be running that. I didn't think there'd be anything to gain, and your car is proof.

 

As far as the price thing goes, bbk ceramic coated shorties from jegs are 479.99 and I paid 525.00 for my jet hot long tubes. Not that much diffference in the price, and you will get more power from the long tubes. In my opinion it is definitely worth going with the long tubes. Just a thought. And to the guy who was saying that the cars needed to be the same to show realistic performance gains, I have another friend who has an a4 93 z28 which is stock except for jet hots and duals, who runs a 13.87 to the 14.2 of the other 93 z that has shorties. Say what you want, Long tubes are better.

 

And you are forgetting that the shorties COME WITH THE Y-PIPE.

Dan

 

I can say what I want? 13.87 isn't impressive...I went 13.47/stock with exhaust manifolds, a cat, and a single exhaust.
That's stock motor/transmission/converter/ and 3.23's. Obviously the LTs aren't worth much.

As another side note...With the same mods as you+4.10 gears, I went 12.82 @ 106 MPH with exhaust manifolds. Never had a valvecover off/stock everything on engine/full weight. Would you like to volunteer how much quicker you're running with your LT's?

Frank