ABS delete..those who have done it come in..
03-27-2007, 06:02 PM
#17
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On our CMC prepped road race 4th gens, we TEE off the brake line that run to the front brakes and the same can be done to a 4 channel rear, I suppose.
Instead of cobbling together existing parts and re-flaring lines, we use Earl's -3AN adaptors out of the MC and to and Earl's -3 to metric TEEs
We then run -3 steel braided brake lines, avaialble at most any dirt track shop from the MC to the TEEs.
Instead of cobbling together existing parts and re-flaring lines, we use Earl's -3AN adaptors out of the MC and to and Earl's -3 to metric TEEs
We then run -3 steel braided brake lines, avaialble at most any dirt track shop from the MC to the TEEs.
do you have pics of the setup? and part numbers for what you used?
03-27-2007, 06:34 PM
#18
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Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 73
Wow! First, before you go "WTF!"ing me next time, try quoting the line that told the original poster to specifically buy new line to replace everything after the master cylinder. I see no such words in my post. I think you are owed a "WTF?"
Second, you can put inverted flares on your car, but I would use bubble flares, exclusively. There is one exception to this, and that is an AN flare. To be blunt, I would never use an inverted flare when I had the opportunity to use a bubble flare or a 37* flare. In a situation with frequent inspection and disconnects, I would prefer to use all 37* fittings. Seeing as there are no blatant circumstances requiring the specific (other than being able to get gouged at the parts store for these when you go to rent their inferior tool) use of a 45* inverted flare, I made my post accordingly. Metric bubble flare fittings are rather inexpensive when you use the 10 mm x 1.0 fittings I specified and GM specified for this car. Let me guess, you would rather go buy adapters to do the job of the correct tubing nut. ...very professional...
Third, making inverted double flares correctly is usually difficult for someone who has not done them before, but there are two more factors making them difficult for this instance: a. the factory tube that GM put on these cars is rather hard compared to your usual parts store, "bundy" tubing as you may know it, and b. parts store rental tools are a fair cry from accurate or precision. Most of the floating-die tools will produce horrid flares unless using soft brake tubing. With a bubble flare tool, you will get a rigid die that has a precision fit inside the vise holding the tube. They are, just about, fail-proof. I haven't even mentioned the effects of work-hardening of an already hard tube, on a double mechanism flaring process! Well, I guess I did, now.
Fourth, there is no such tool, that I have heard off, that will produce your "metric double flare." Furthermore, how are you going to create this metric double flare with a 3/16" SAE 45* tubing nut, and have it seal into a female port that requires metric threads and a metric bubble flare?
Fifth, you so eagerly neglected the fact that the original poster is removing an entire ABS system. As you should know (I should think otherwise from your posts), brake lines are screwed into the ABS motor packs and valve. This means there must be a coupling connection to connect the master cylinder lines, which used to thread into the combination valve, to the front and rear brake lines. I guess you simply miracle them together, by intuition, with no additional brake line? Or do you pull and yank on the brake lines until they meet their partner? I wouldn't know.
Sixth, your professionalism and appealing know-how is summed up in the above quoted text. Judging by your—shall I say, bright—ideas, I should think that someone pulled your light bulb out.
Kudos, Pilot!
Second, you can put inverted flares on your car, but I would use bubble flares, exclusively. There is one exception to this, and that is an AN flare. To be blunt, I would never use an inverted flare when I had the opportunity to use a bubble flare or a 37* flare. In a situation with frequent inspection and disconnects, I would prefer to use all 37* fittings. Seeing as there are no blatant circumstances requiring the specific (other than being able to get gouged at the parts store for these when you go to rent their inferior tool) use of a 45* inverted flare, I made my post accordingly. Metric bubble flare fittings are rather inexpensive when you use the 10 mm x 1.0 fittings I specified and GM specified for this car. Let me guess, you would rather go buy adapters to do the job of the correct tubing nut. ...very professional...
Third, making inverted double flares correctly is usually difficult for someone who has not done them before, but there are two more factors making them difficult for this instance: a. the factory tube that GM put on these cars is rather hard compared to your usual parts store, "bundy" tubing as you may know it, and b. parts store rental tools are a fair cry from accurate or precision. Most of the floating-die tools will produce horrid flares unless using soft brake tubing. With a bubble flare tool, you will get a rigid die that has a precision fit inside the vise holding the tube. They are, just about, fail-proof. I haven't even mentioned the effects of work-hardening of an already hard tube, on a double mechanism flaring process! Well, I guess I did, now.
Fourth, there is no such tool, that I have heard off, that will produce your "metric double flare." Furthermore, how are you going to create this metric double flare with a 3/16" SAE 45* tubing nut, and have it seal into a female port that requires metric threads and a metric bubble flare?
Fifth, you so eagerly neglected the fact that the original poster is removing an entire ABS system. As you should know (I should think otherwise from your posts), brake lines are screwed into the ABS motor packs and valve. This means there must be a coupling connection to connect the master cylinder lines, which used to thread into the combination valve, to the front and rear brake lines. I guess you simply miracle them together, by intuition, with no additional brake line? Or do you pull and yank on the brake lines until they meet their partner? I wouldn't know.
Sixth, your professionalism and appealing know-how is summed up in the above quoted text. Judging by your—shall I say, bright—ideas, I should think that someone pulled your light bulb out.
Kudos, Pilot!
Last edited by Alan Namsa; 03-27-2007 at 06:36 PM.
03-27-2007, 07:34 PM
#19
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Join Date: Apr 1999
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,227
Ya, that would work too. However, the standard brass fittings can be bought at any auto parts store for less than $20 for all of them. The cutting and flaring only took me about 2hrs and looked very professional. I practiced on some of the line I cut off before I did the actual flares and it turned out right the first time. Now that I know how to flare lines I'm considering putting a hard line fuel system together. That should save alot of money over running -8 hose the whole length of the car.
What is CMC prepped? Is that a shop?
What is CMC prepped? Is that a shop?
I've witnessed reflared lines splitting. It rarely happens, but I've seen it happen. I'm sure it was user error, but I'm not comfortable with it, so I chose a differnt route. Yours is perfectly fine. I was just adding to the conversation.
Oh, I ran conventional line from the TEE to the rears, not -8. Everything is -3 or 3/16" brake line purchased at Autozone.. I welded in a bulkhead connector in the firewall and ran the rear brake line inside the cabin, installed a proportioning valve next to where the e-brake was and then to another bulkhead fitting at the rear.
Here is a pic of the way we have done it. It's big for detail ...
The lines coming out of the MC are now steel braided.
See the adaptors in the MC? Metric (10mm - 1.5 x 3/16 from Edlemen) 3/16" line out and down along the frame rail to a TEE hidden by the fuel lines. Sorry. But you can see the bulkhead connector welded to the inner fender. Other side is a steel braided line going to the caliper. The passenger side front runs along the lower core support and does basically the same thing as the driver's side. We got the brake lines off of the K-Member so that when we pull a motor out the bottom, we don't have to breech the brake system.
Like I said, this isn't the cheapest, but it certainly is worry and headache free.
03-27-2007, 08:19 PM
#20
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Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Florence, Kentucky
Posts: 1,546
Nice setup Mitchntx. Sorry, I thought you meant steel braided hose. That would get expensive in a hurry. LOL. BTW I'm originally from Plano, TX.
Last edited by 97WS6Pilot; 03-28-2007 at 06:24 AM.
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